1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:04,546 --> 00:00:07,549 ♪ 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 4 00:00:12,346 --> 00:00:15,349 ♪ soft choir singing ♪ 5 00:00:28,695 --> 00:00:30,948 [children chattering, laughing] 6 00:00:44,670 --> 00:00:48,340 NIA: Here in Iowa, there is something called "Iowa nice." 7 00:00:49,466 --> 00:00:52,010 It is really Iowa passive aggressiveness, 8 00:00:52,010 --> 00:00:53,595 and it is-- 9 00:00:53,595 --> 00:00:56,974 no one is ever gonna say, "I don't support you" to your face. 10 00:00:58,350 --> 00:01:01,478 They're going to be very kind to you, 11 00:01:01,478 --> 00:01:04,231 and then they're gonna have a letter-writing campaign 12 00:01:04,231 --> 00:01:06,483 to get you kicked off of whatever committee 13 00:01:06,483 --> 00:01:08,318 or whatever thing behind your back. 14 00:01:09,152 --> 00:01:10,404 ♪ 15 00:01:10,404 --> 00:01:13,031 KATIE: We both grew up in Des Moines. 16 00:01:13,031 --> 00:01:14,992 We've been here our whole lives. We've never left. 17 00:01:14,992 --> 00:01:16,034 NIA: Yeah. 18 00:01:16,535 --> 00:01:19,955 And then, we both had similar home lives 19 00:01:19,955 --> 00:01:21,373 and church lives. 20 00:01:22,749 --> 00:01:26,044 We met in second grade, and became really best friends in-- 21 00:01:26,044 --> 00:01:27,421 KATIE: Eighth grade. NIA: Yeah. 22 00:01:28,839 --> 00:01:32,801 You accepted me and I-- before I even could accept myself, 23 00:01:32,801 --> 00:01:35,220 and I don't know that you even knew what it was, 24 00:01:35,220 --> 00:01:38,265 but you saw the essence of me, 25 00:01:38,265 --> 00:01:40,475 aside from gender. 26 00:01:42,144 --> 00:01:46,148 KATIE: In our small private school and in our churches, 27 00:01:46,148 --> 00:01:49,443 when you dated, you were dating to marry someone. 28 00:01:49,443 --> 00:01:51,528 So, when we started dating 29 00:01:51,528 --> 00:01:54,698 at 17 and 16, respectively, 30 00:01:54,698 --> 00:01:57,743 it was pretty much on the marriage track. 31 00:01:57,743 --> 00:02:00,746 ♪ 32 00:02:00,746 --> 00:02:03,957 [children chattering] 33 00:02:05,167 --> 00:02:06,710 I did want a really big family. 34 00:02:06,710 --> 00:02:09,713 That's just always been something for me, that family is. 35 00:02:11,215 --> 00:02:14,343 And then, I loved the whole thing. 36 00:02:14,343 --> 00:02:15,886 I loved being pregnant, 37 00:02:15,886 --> 00:02:18,263 I loved giving birth. 38 00:02:18,263 --> 00:02:20,807 It was so fantastic. [laughs] 39 00:02:20,807 --> 00:02:22,559 And then they just kept coming, and we were like, 40 00:02:22,559 --> 00:02:24,102 "Okay, let 'em come." 41 00:02:24,102 --> 00:02:26,313 And then we decided to adopt. 42 00:02:28,690 --> 00:02:30,317 ♪ 43 00:02:30,317 --> 00:02:33,028 They are so loved and well-respected in our community. 44 00:02:33,028 --> 00:02:34,488 You know, because our kids are in school, 45 00:02:34,488 --> 00:02:36,573 they're seen more than we are, 46 00:02:36,573 --> 00:02:38,408 and so they really do pave the way. 47 00:02:38,408 --> 00:02:40,619 By the time that people get to us, 48 00:02:40,619 --> 00:02:42,162 they already know our kids, and they're like, 49 00:02:42,162 --> 00:02:44,998 "Oh, you must be great because your kids are fantastic." 50 00:02:44,998 --> 00:02:48,752 [inaudible] 51 00:02:53,465 --> 00:02:55,843 NIA: I initially came out to myself, 52 00:02:55,843 --> 00:02:57,719 and came out to Katie the same day 53 00:02:57,719 --> 00:02:59,346 that I kind of came out to myself 54 00:02:59,346 --> 00:03:02,558 'cause I thought that was only fair based on our relationship. 55 00:03:04,226 --> 00:03:06,436 When we told the kids, she did a really good job 56 00:03:06,436 --> 00:03:08,355 of drawing a picture for them. 57 00:03:08,355 --> 00:03:09,815 ♪ 58 00:03:09,815 --> 00:03:12,734 KATIE: I drew a picture for the kids that was, 59 00:03:12,734 --> 00:03:14,403 "Here's our bodies, 60 00:03:14,403 --> 00:03:16,697 "and some people have male bodies. 61 00:03:16,697 --> 00:03:18,782 "And some people have female bodies. 62 00:03:18,782 --> 00:03:19,908 "Here's our spirits. 63 00:03:19,908 --> 00:03:22,953 "Some people have male spirits, very masculine spirits, 64 00:03:22,953 --> 00:03:25,455 "and some people have very feminine spirits. 65 00:03:25,455 --> 00:03:29,126 "And so sometimes, those things go together. 66 00:03:29,126 --> 00:03:31,170 "Other times, they don't go together. 67 00:03:31,170 --> 00:03:34,965 "So sometimes, our outsides match our insides, 68 00:03:34,965 --> 00:03:36,216 "and sometimes they don't, 69 00:03:36,216 --> 00:03:38,302 and that's called being transgender." 70 00:03:38,302 --> 00:03:40,429 And they were like, "Okay, duh." 71 00:03:40,429 --> 00:03:44,183 Like, they didn't have any reservations about it. 72 00:03:44,183 --> 00:03:47,144 - You wanna crack the eggs? - Dads always crack the eggs! 73 00:03:47,144 --> 00:03:49,605 CHILD: It was a little weird, 74 00:03:49,605 --> 00:03:52,608 but we all like kind of... - Adapted. 75 00:03:52,608 --> 00:03:53,901 Adapted pretty quickly. 76 00:03:53,901 --> 00:03:56,195 Well, we just added an O to Mom. 77 00:03:56,195 --> 00:03:57,654 [laughter] 78 00:03:57,654 --> 00:03:59,448 [kitchen chatter] 79 00:03:59,448 --> 00:04:00,532 Are we making scrambled eggs? 80 00:04:00,532 --> 00:04:03,744 Yeah CHILD: We still call both of them Mom, 81 00:04:03,744 --> 00:04:05,245 but it doesn't get confusing. 82 00:04:05,245 --> 00:04:08,373 It's just like we know who we're talking about. 83 00:04:08,373 --> 00:04:11,668 If I asked one of my moms to come downstairs to tuck me in, 84 00:04:11,668 --> 00:04:13,295 the other one comes. [laughter] 85 00:04:14,087 --> 00:04:16,840 Mom, I'll take three! [chattering] 86 00:04:16,840 --> 00:04:18,842 NIA: Three? - Three. 87 00:04:18,842 --> 00:04:21,136 NIA: You know, whatever they needed to call me, they could call me. 88 00:04:21,136 --> 00:04:23,889 And so, they called me Dad for a long time 89 00:04:23,889 --> 00:04:25,516 after I had come out, 90 00:04:25,516 --> 00:04:28,352 and even after I had started to transition 91 00:04:28,352 --> 00:04:30,979 and had come out really publicly, 92 00:04:30,979 --> 00:04:33,065 and we finally got to a point where we were 93 00:04:33,065 --> 00:04:36,026 on a cross-country road trip down to Texas, 94 00:04:36,026 --> 00:04:39,071 and we were in a Southern state in a gas station, 95 00:04:39,071 --> 00:04:40,948 and I'm coming out of the women's restroom, 96 00:04:40,948 --> 00:04:44,493 and they're yelling across the Conoco or whatever it was, 97 00:04:44,493 --> 00:04:46,286 "Dad! Dad!" whatever. 98 00:04:46,286 --> 00:04:48,914 And we got in the car, and I said, "Okay. 99 00:04:48,914 --> 00:04:51,291 "We might need to rethink this because this, 100 00:04:51,291 --> 00:04:54,378 this may end up not being safe for us." 101 00:04:54,378 --> 00:04:57,381 Within the hour, they were like, "How about Momo?" 102 00:04:57,381 --> 00:04:59,550 And I'm like, that's great, you know? 103 00:04:59,550 --> 00:05:03,428 And they switched like on a dime, and have not looked back. 104 00:05:03,428 --> 00:05:07,015 - It's on your French toast. - Yeah, but it's not on this one. 105 00:05:07,015 --> 00:05:10,102 NIA: It's more unusual here in rural Iowa 106 00:05:10,102 --> 00:05:13,146 to have two parents with the same gender. 107 00:05:13,146 --> 00:05:15,816 So, it's coming out more, but they're pretty good, 108 00:05:15,816 --> 00:05:17,818 and they know how to handle that kind of stuff. 109 00:05:17,818 --> 00:05:20,362 ♪ 110 00:05:20,362 --> 00:05:23,240 My family was very surprised. 111 00:05:24,283 --> 00:05:26,076 I think they thought 112 00:05:26,076 --> 00:05:28,996 they had the all-American man 113 00:05:28,996 --> 00:05:31,206 and father and son. 114 00:05:31,206 --> 00:05:34,918 They came back immediately and said, "I love-- We love you." You know? 115 00:05:34,918 --> 00:05:37,588 And that was kind of it. And I thought, oh, that's a good response. 116 00:05:37,588 --> 00:05:39,631 And then, it kind of, from there, you know, 117 00:05:39,631 --> 00:05:42,467 more discussion about religion and things like that, 118 00:05:42,467 --> 00:05:45,262 which, um, kind of devolved over time, 119 00:05:45,262 --> 00:05:48,223 and so, they, they were surprised, 120 00:05:48,223 --> 00:05:50,726 and I think remain that way 121 00:05:50,726 --> 00:05:52,603 [laughs] to this day. 122 00:05:53,437 --> 00:05:57,024 I do not have contact with my parents 123 00:05:57,024 --> 00:05:58,567 or my sister. 124 00:05:58,567 --> 00:06:00,444 I do have a brother that I speak to. 125 00:06:00,444 --> 00:06:02,696 ♪ 126 00:06:02,696 --> 00:06:04,948 CHRIS: It took me by surprise for sure. 127 00:06:05,908 --> 00:06:08,493 Nia and I's relationship has, um... 128 00:06:09,161 --> 00:06:11,163 it was incredibly strong. 129 00:06:11,580 --> 00:06:14,541 We were very close, our families were very close. 130 00:06:14,541 --> 00:06:16,418 You know, over the years, 131 00:06:16,418 --> 00:06:18,795 it's just evolved into something 132 00:06:18,795 --> 00:06:21,048 that wasn't what it was before. 133 00:06:22,257 --> 00:06:25,052 KATIE: He kind of acted as the middle man between Nia 134 00:06:25,052 --> 00:06:27,137 and the rest of the family. 135 00:06:27,137 --> 00:06:30,849 And I think that that's a very difficult position for anyone. 136 00:06:31,558 --> 00:06:34,061 So, I would hope that that can be... 137 00:06:35,103 --> 00:06:38,815 mended to a place where we're close. We're all close again. 138 00:06:39,316 --> 00:06:42,736 But I think too that there's so many boundaries 139 00:06:42,736 --> 00:06:45,072 that have to be drawn in order for everyone 140 00:06:45,072 --> 00:06:47,157 to stay safe and continue healing. 141 00:06:49,868 --> 00:06:51,411 NIA: Katie was preaching at our church 142 00:06:51,411 --> 00:06:54,498 and it was a non-denominational evangelical church. 143 00:06:54,498 --> 00:06:57,793 KATIE: I mean, the stance is that homosexuality is a sin. 144 00:06:57,793 --> 00:07:00,921 That's the byline, right? [laughs] NIA: Yeah, yeah. 145 00:07:00,921 --> 00:07:04,800 And I think that there is a push towards welcoming, 146 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:06,426 but not affirming. 147 00:07:06,426 --> 00:07:09,137 I don't think the realization has been made 148 00:07:09,137 --> 00:07:12,140 that that's more damaging than just saying, "No." 149 00:07:12,140 --> 00:07:14,017 ♪ 150 00:07:14,017 --> 00:07:16,019 NIA: When I came out, 151 00:07:16,019 --> 00:07:19,523 all of the energy got focused onto Katie and her preaching. 152 00:07:20,566 --> 00:07:22,651 Nobody would outright say, you know, 153 00:07:22,651 --> 00:07:24,987 something that was transphobic, 154 00:07:24,987 --> 00:07:27,489 but it was, "Katie, your theology is bad." 155 00:07:28,866 --> 00:07:31,577 KATIE: I think the other layer to that, too, with being a woman 156 00:07:31,577 --> 00:07:34,788 preaching in the evangelical context 157 00:07:34,788 --> 00:07:36,623 was already like, 158 00:07:36,623 --> 00:07:40,335 "We're allowing you to do this." [laughs] Because we were 159 00:07:40,335 --> 00:07:43,505 a more progressive evangelical... 160 00:07:43,505 --> 00:07:45,549 non-denominational church. 161 00:07:45,549 --> 00:07:49,219 We just pushed beyond what that tradition 162 00:07:49,219 --> 00:07:50,846 was willing to hold. 163 00:07:54,474 --> 00:07:56,852 I desperately miss the church. 164 00:07:56,852 --> 00:07:58,228 ♪ 165 00:07:58,228 --> 00:07:59,229 [forced laugh] 166 00:08:00,189 --> 00:08:02,524 Nobody really asks me this question, so sorry. 167 00:08:02,524 --> 00:08:05,527 There's like a lot of emotion attached to it. 168 00:08:06,862 --> 00:08:09,948 I gave a significant amount of my life to the church 169 00:08:10,908 --> 00:08:13,994 because I love the people so much. 170 00:08:15,454 --> 00:08:18,290 And I really love the ideas 171 00:08:18,290 --> 00:08:20,459 that Jesus represents. 172 00:08:20,459 --> 00:08:23,003 Of unconditional love, 173 00:08:23,003 --> 00:08:25,422 of reaching out to those who are marginalized. 174 00:08:25,422 --> 00:08:28,091 I mean, probably because I did have a queer identity. 175 00:08:28,091 --> 00:08:29,426 I didn't know it my whole life. 176 00:08:29,426 --> 00:08:31,970 That Jesus spoke those things to me, 177 00:08:31,970 --> 00:08:33,722 that I was acceptable. 178 00:08:33,722 --> 00:08:36,558 And it utterly breaks my heart 179 00:08:36,558 --> 00:08:39,645 that my unconditional love for Nia 180 00:08:39,645 --> 00:08:42,814 was the thing that had to break my relationship with the church. 181 00:08:42,814 --> 00:08:44,691 Because, for me... 182 00:08:45,567 --> 00:08:46,944 it is the church. 183 00:08:46,944 --> 00:08:49,738 Like, for me, this is my religion. 184 00:08:49,738 --> 00:08:50,822 This is my faith. 185 00:08:50,822 --> 00:08:53,075 This kind of love. 186 00:08:53,075 --> 00:08:55,744 ♪ 187 00:08:55,744 --> 00:08:58,872 [street noise] [indistinct chatter] 188 00:09:00,791 --> 00:09:02,835 JASPER: Yeah, I tried out a couple different names 189 00:09:02,835 --> 00:09:05,379 and had like some close friends use it with me 190 00:09:05,379 --> 00:09:07,130 and my siblings. - Mm-hmm. Yeah. 191 00:09:07,130 --> 00:09:08,841 How did that process feel? 192 00:09:08,841 --> 00:09:10,676 I mean, it was odd. 193 00:09:10,676 --> 00:09:11,885 - Yeah. - Because there was nothing 194 00:09:11,885 --> 00:09:14,304 that felt right for a while. - Yeah. 195 00:09:14,972 --> 00:09:17,099 I have found community in other places. 196 00:09:17,099 --> 00:09:19,768 That is the thing that the church really gave me, 197 00:09:19,768 --> 00:09:21,979 and the thing that I loved about church 198 00:09:21,979 --> 00:09:24,439 was the relationship, 199 00:09:24,439 --> 00:09:27,651 and I think God is relationship, and so, to me, 200 00:09:27,651 --> 00:09:31,196 you know, finding that in other places is, is finding God elsewhere. 201 00:09:31,196 --> 00:09:35,033 - Yeah, absolutely. Hi! [laughs] - Good to see you. Hi. 202 00:09:35,033 --> 00:09:38,328 KATIE: One of the biggest struggles for me is finding belonging. 203 00:09:38,996 --> 00:09:42,708 When Nia came out, finding my own label was really difficult. 204 00:09:42,708 --> 00:09:45,460 [overlapping chatter] 205 00:09:46,253 --> 00:09:48,505 I'd like to say that Nia gifted me my queerness. 206 00:09:49,131 --> 00:09:52,551 She really gifted me that awareness that, 207 00:09:52,551 --> 00:09:55,137 you know, you thought you were this one person, 208 00:09:55,137 --> 00:09:57,139 but because you didn't have 209 00:09:57,139 --> 00:09:59,474 the experiences that you needed, you didn't get to find out 210 00:09:59,474 --> 00:10:02,060 that your whole person 211 00:10:02,060 --> 00:10:04,313 is a lot richer and deeper than you thought. 212 00:10:05,731 --> 00:10:07,399 [laughter] 213 00:10:07,399 --> 00:10:10,027 Let's talk about a dream summit because when was the last time we did that? 214 00:10:10,903 --> 00:10:14,281 KATIE: I say ambiguously queer because I don't know. 215 00:10:15,115 --> 00:10:17,367 And I was just talking with another spouse 216 00:10:17,367 --> 00:10:19,578 of another trans person the other day, 217 00:10:19,578 --> 00:10:20,954 and they were saying the same thing. 218 00:10:20,954 --> 00:10:23,665 "I don't really know where I fit. 219 00:10:23,665 --> 00:10:27,044 I don't know what label you'd put on me." 220 00:10:27,044 --> 00:10:30,547 So, I think we're like the labelless few 221 00:10:30,547 --> 00:10:32,299 [laughs] right now 222 00:10:32,299 --> 00:10:35,886 of, you know, spouses of people who have transitioned. 223 00:10:35,886 --> 00:10:38,805 And I think, for most of us, we're okay with that. 224 00:10:39,181 --> 00:10:41,767 But it does feel a little bit like 225 00:10:41,767 --> 00:10:44,019 where do we belong inside of the queer community? 226 00:10:44,019 --> 00:10:47,022 [laughter, chatter] [clapping] 227 00:10:47,648 --> 00:10:50,943 I keep asking you! [children chattering] 228 00:10:50,943 --> 00:10:53,028 NIA: We have thought about leaving the Midwest. 229 00:10:53,028 --> 00:10:55,697 We think about leaving the Midwest all the time. 230 00:10:57,241 --> 00:10:59,576 NIA: It seems like on a daily basis, 231 00:10:59,576 --> 00:11:01,537 our state does not want us here 232 00:11:01,537 --> 00:11:02,996 as queer individuals. 233 00:11:02,996 --> 00:11:04,706 [chattering] 234 00:11:04,706 --> 00:11:08,252 We legalized gay marriage 13 years ago. 235 00:11:08,252 --> 00:11:11,046 Now, we've swung the other direction, 236 00:11:11,046 --> 00:11:14,550 and we are with all of the states that are leading the way 237 00:11:14,550 --> 00:11:16,927 with anti-LGBTQ legislation. 238 00:11:16,927 --> 00:11:20,597 [chatter continues] 239 00:11:20,597 --> 00:11:23,267 What really got me involved in kind of the political scene 240 00:11:23,267 --> 00:11:25,686 was they tried to take the gender identity protection 241 00:11:25,686 --> 00:11:27,187 out of Iowa code. 242 00:11:27,187 --> 00:11:29,940 Which would mean, if that was gone, I could get fired, 243 00:11:29,940 --> 00:11:32,401 I could be denied housing, I could, you know, 244 00:11:32,401 --> 00:11:34,778 be denied credit for being a trans person. 245 00:11:34,778 --> 00:11:37,281 [chatter continues] 246 00:11:37,281 --> 00:11:39,950 I think the biggest struggle in the trans community 247 00:11:39,950 --> 00:11:43,203 is being seen, and it feels like 248 00:11:43,203 --> 00:11:45,330 we're not seen at all. 249 00:11:45,330 --> 00:11:49,042 As humans, as people who have lives and kids. 250 00:11:49,042 --> 00:11:51,378 ♪ 251 00:11:51,378 --> 00:11:54,923 We're an issue currently, and it's hard because, 252 00:11:54,923 --> 00:11:56,425 other than one-to-one conversations, 253 00:11:56,425 --> 00:11:58,719 how do you help people understand that 254 00:11:58,719 --> 00:12:00,429 these are our lives that we're talking about? 255 00:12:00,429 --> 00:12:01,722 They're not issues. 256 00:12:01,722 --> 00:12:05,684 [chatter continues] 257 00:12:06,727 --> 00:12:09,438 KATIE: I still don't feel rooted into this community. 258 00:12:09,438 --> 00:12:11,023 But, you wonder, 259 00:12:11,023 --> 00:12:13,775 do we stay and fight, or do we go somewhere? 260 00:12:13,775 --> 00:12:15,277 But, where do you go? 261 00:12:15,277 --> 00:12:18,697 Where putting down roots is acceptable? 262 00:12:18,697 --> 00:12:20,991 Where there's stability and safety. 263 00:12:20,991 --> 00:12:23,577 Because it does feel like, at any moment, 264 00:12:23,577 --> 00:12:26,038 anywhere, it could change. 265 00:12:26,038 --> 00:12:29,041 [laughter, chatter] 266 00:12:34,755 --> 00:12:38,008 ♪ 267 00:12:41,512 --> 00:12:44,681 MONTE: In this community, we 100% stand out. 268 00:12:44,681 --> 00:12:45,766 MARIO: Absolutely. 269 00:12:45,766 --> 00:12:47,893 We are probably one of the... 270 00:12:47,893 --> 00:12:50,812 one out of three Black families, let alone gay families. 271 00:12:52,814 --> 00:12:56,276 A lot of people assume that we're brothers or cousins. 272 00:12:56,985 --> 00:12:59,947 You just know they're kind of like, "What is this? Like, 273 00:12:59,947 --> 00:13:00,989 which one? Who's the--" 274 00:13:00,989 --> 00:13:03,075 "This is new in Midwest Nebraska." 275 00:13:03,075 --> 00:13:04,701 - Yeah. - "What is this?" 276 00:13:04,701 --> 00:13:06,787 [TV chatter] 277 00:13:06,787 --> 00:13:10,082 Spink will be over here as well. [indistinct] 278 00:13:10,415 --> 00:13:13,335 MONTE: They never assume that we're dating until we tell them, 279 00:13:13,335 --> 00:13:15,712 and then they're like, which one's more masculine, more effeminate? 280 00:13:16,421 --> 00:13:18,632 You know, we're just who we are. 281 00:13:18,632 --> 00:13:21,552 ♪ 282 00:13:24,847 --> 00:13:28,267 Our baby brings joy. 283 00:13:28,267 --> 00:13:29,893 When I see her, 284 00:13:29,893 --> 00:13:32,896 I am just overwhelmed with emotion, and, wow. 285 00:13:32,896 --> 00:13:35,482 This little sweet thing loves me, 286 00:13:35,482 --> 00:13:37,025 regardless of what I do. 287 00:13:38,694 --> 00:13:41,363 All she knows is her dads, 288 00:13:41,363 --> 00:13:43,198 and her surrogate mom, who's involved. 289 00:13:43,198 --> 00:13:44,992 [indistinct chatter] 290 00:13:45,409 --> 00:13:47,911 MARIO: Ariel is the biological mother of our child. 291 00:13:47,911 --> 00:13:50,497 We did mystery sperm. - Mystery sperm. Mm-hmm. 292 00:13:50,497 --> 00:13:52,666 And so, you know, we did our thing, 293 00:13:52,666 --> 00:13:54,668 put it in the cup, swirled it around. 294 00:13:54,668 --> 00:13:56,461 - So that we both had a fair chance. - Yep. 295 00:13:56,461 --> 00:13:58,964 [inaudible] 296 00:13:58,964 --> 00:14:01,341 I got my hair done today, and they're like, "So... 297 00:14:01,341 --> 00:14:02,968 How'd you hear? Like, did you sign up for this?" 298 00:14:02,968 --> 00:14:05,804 I'm like, no, I... - It just kinda came about. 299 00:14:05,804 --> 00:14:07,514 Yeah. I was like, I actually know these guys. 300 00:14:08,223 --> 00:14:11,810 Mario and Monte told us they were looking to have a baby. 301 00:14:11,810 --> 00:14:14,354 My cousins actually joked, like, "Hey, you should ask Ariel. 302 00:14:14,354 --> 00:14:16,732 She has super easy labors and births." 303 00:14:16,732 --> 00:14:19,193 She calls, and says, "Hey, 304 00:14:19,193 --> 00:14:20,736 I would actually be willing to do that." 305 00:14:20,736 --> 00:14:23,447 ♪ 306 00:14:23,447 --> 00:14:25,073 Hello! 307 00:14:25,073 --> 00:14:28,160 [baby cooing] Hello. Hi, Daddy's baby girl. 308 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:30,245 Little cute shoes. - Oh, those are cute. I love that bow. 309 00:14:30,245 --> 00:14:31,622 MONTE: Mm-hmm. 310 00:14:31,622 --> 00:14:33,957 ARIEL: My mom was very supportive about it. 311 00:14:33,957 --> 00:14:35,292 My dad, not so much. 312 00:14:35,292 --> 00:14:38,212 He told me that, you know, "I still don't believe in this, 313 00:14:38,212 --> 00:14:39,630 but you do what you wanna do." 314 00:14:39,630 --> 00:14:42,132 [children chattering] MAN: Halle, look what I got. 315 00:14:42,132 --> 00:14:44,635 [paper crinkling] [party chatter] 316 00:14:44,635 --> 00:14:46,512 ASHLEY: There's a lot of people who are more conservative 317 00:14:46,512 --> 00:14:49,473 in our family and lean more towards 318 00:14:49,473 --> 00:14:51,433 like a traditional family. 319 00:14:51,433 --> 00:14:53,143 So, I think that played into effect a little bit. 320 00:14:53,143 --> 00:14:54,895 [chatter continues] 321 00:14:54,895 --> 00:14:56,939 We don't wanna focus on that. We wanna focus on the fact 322 00:14:56,939 --> 00:14:58,649 that Monte and Mario are here 323 00:14:58,649 --> 00:15:00,943 to have a family, a positive family, 324 00:15:00,943 --> 00:15:04,863 and raise Marayla with good values and to be a good person. 325 00:15:04,863 --> 00:15:07,741 [indistinct chatter] 326 00:15:07,741 --> 00:15:09,993 MONTE: We want to raise her somewhat opposite 327 00:15:09,993 --> 00:15:13,121 of how we were raised a little bit, 328 00:15:13,121 --> 00:15:16,208 like kind of forced to choose and forced to be, 329 00:15:16,208 --> 00:15:18,377 you know, pretend to be something that you're not. 330 00:15:18,961 --> 00:15:21,255 We believe in choice, 331 00:15:21,255 --> 00:15:23,966 when she's able to have choice, 332 00:15:23,966 --> 00:15:25,634 but we don't wanna force her to do anything 333 00:15:25,634 --> 00:15:27,094 that she's not comfortable with. 334 00:15:29,179 --> 00:15:31,598 My grandfather was a pastor. 335 00:15:31,598 --> 00:15:33,433 Growing up in the church, 336 00:15:33,433 --> 00:15:35,769 that's all I knew. 337 00:15:35,769 --> 00:15:38,772 ♪ singing gospel music ♪ 338 00:15:38,772 --> 00:15:42,109 ♪ drums, keyboard playing ♪ 339 00:15:42,109 --> 00:15:45,487 We met at the church. I was a director of music. 340 00:15:46,738 --> 00:15:49,449 MONTE: I think he noticed me more before I noticed him. 341 00:15:50,409 --> 00:15:52,786 Well actually, he was flirting with me, 342 00:15:52,786 --> 00:15:53,912 and I didn't know that he was. 343 00:15:53,912 --> 00:15:55,873 I didn't even know that he was gay, honestly. 344 00:15:58,041 --> 00:16:01,587 MARIO: I remember coming out to my mom with Monte. 345 00:16:02,671 --> 00:16:05,299 That was scary because 346 00:16:05,299 --> 00:16:09,136 growing up in the church and where everyone stands with that. 347 00:16:10,053 --> 00:16:14,266 Do you remember me coming out to you? 348 00:16:14,641 --> 00:16:17,269 [pops lips] Yes. MARIO: What was that like for you? 349 00:16:17,728 --> 00:16:19,688 It was pretty traumatic. 350 00:16:19,688 --> 00:16:22,149 I cried probably for 72 hours. 351 00:16:22,733 --> 00:16:25,152 It affects me to this day 352 00:16:25,152 --> 00:16:27,321 because... 353 00:16:27,321 --> 00:16:29,907 in the Christian community, 354 00:16:31,491 --> 00:16:34,077 we still struggle with that. 355 00:16:34,870 --> 00:16:36,163 Okay. 356 00:16:36,538 --> 00:16:39,041 Have you ever prayed, like, 357 00:16:39,917 --> 00:16:43,462 to at least make make me not gay or... 358 00:16:44,296 --> 00:16:46,590 Oh yeah, of course, I prayed that. In the beginning. 359 00:16:46,590 --> 00:16:48,467 I told you I cried for 72 hours straight. [Mario laughs] 360 00:16:49,343 --> 00:16:51,595 It was a disappointment, but with love. 361 00:16:52,846 --> 00:16:54,848 And there was just love. 362 00:16:54,848 --> 00:16:56,892 ♪ 363 00:16:56,892 --> 00:16:59,561 MONTE: The first five years of our marriage, 364 00:16:59,561 --> 00:17:02,397 no one really knew other than like our really close people. 365 00:17:03,148 --> 00:17:06,276 We weren't able to truly show how in love we were 366 00:17:06,276 --> 00:17:07,569 and how happy we were 367 00:17:08,028 --> 00:17:10,614 because, at the time, we're still hiding from the church. 368 00:17:11,823 --> 00:17:14,826 ♪ singing gospel music ♪ 369 00:17:14,826 --> 00:17:16,995 ♪ drums, keyboard playing ♪ 370 00:17:17,496 --> 00:17:19,706 MARIO: So the church found out that we were dating. 371 00:17:20,290 --> 00:17:22,626 The pastor wanted to meet with me. 372 00:17:22,626 --> 00:17:24,294 Monte's name came up, and then he said, 373 00:17:24,294 --> 00:17:26,088 "Well, what's your guys' relationship?" 374 00:17:26,088 --> 00:17:27,798 And I said, "Well, we're married." 375 00:17:29,258 --> 00:17:30,717 And he says, "Well, right now, 376 00:17:30,717 --> 00:17:33,345 "you're gonna be relieved from all administerial duties, and... 377 00:17:34,972 --> 00:17:36,932 "we'll figure out what, what to do from here. 378 00:17:36,932 --> 00:17:39,434 But right now, we just need to stop." 379 00:17:39,434 --> 00:17:42,688 He said, "I don't want a divorce. I want an annulment." 380 00:17:43,814 --> 00:17:46,650 MONTE: I was kicked out of a church before 381 00:17:46,650 --> 00:17:48,610 for being known as gay. 382 00:17:48,610 --> 00:17:52,281 And I just remember the flashbacks of this happened before. 383 00:17:53,699 --> 00:17:55,993 MARIO: What am I doing wrong? Why-- 384 00:17:55,993 --> 00:17:58,495 Why is this being taken away from me? And... 385 00:18:00,539 --> 00:18:03,959 at the same time, I still wanted things to go forward. 386 00:18:03,959 --> 00:18:06,170 [band chatter] 387 00:18:06,170 --> 00:18:10,132 ♪ trumpet warming up ♪ 388 00:18:10,132 --> 00:18:11,633 Where your cymbals at? 389 00:18:12,217 --> 00:18:13,594 You wanna put this on? 390 00:18:13,594 --> 00:18:15,721 [laughs, indistinct] 391 00:18:16,805 --> 00:18:19,558 MARIO: After we decided not to get the annulment, 392 00:18:19,558 --> 00:18:23,520 found the opportunity to go into the Air Force. 393 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:25,981 My professor was a retired chief 394 00:18:25,981 --> 00:18:27,733 of the Air Force Band. - Right. 395 00:18:28,192 --> 00:18:30,444 And my thought was ching! Here we go. 396 00:18:30,444 --> 00:18:33,947 ♪ upbeat music playing ♪ 397 00:18:33,947 --> 00:18:36,450 ♪ Of joy and gladness ♪ 398 00:18:36,450 --> 00:18:39,578 ♪ Will always banish sadness ♪ 399 00:18:39,578 --> 00:18:41,538 ♪ And strife ♪ 400 00:18:41,538 --> 00:18:43,916 MARIO: That's where my connection with God 401 00:18:43,916 --> 00:18:46,084 really gets connected from is music, 402 00:18:46,084 --> 00:18:47,711 is worship, 403 00:18:47,711 --> 00:18:49,880 and being in an environment where there's a lot of people doing 404 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:51,465 the same thing, same type of mindset. 405 00:18:51,465 --> 00:18:53,842 ♪ So, always look for ♪ 406 00:18:53,842 --> 00:18:57,095 ♪ That silver lining and try to find ♪ 407 00:18:57,095 --> 00:18:59,431 ♪ The sunny side of ♪ 408 00:18:59,431 --> 00:19:02,559 ♪ Life... ♪ 409 00:19:02,559 --> 00:19:05,729 ♪ upbeat music fades ♪ 410 00:19:05,729 --> 00:19:09,650 MONTE: When he told me that we're gonna be stationed in Nebraska, I was pissed. 411 00:19:09,650 --> 00:19:11,693 ♪ 412 00:19:11,693 --> 00:19:15,030 We just come from a liberal state, Colorado, 413 00:19:15,030 --> 00:19:16,740 to this? Like, no. 414 00:19:16,740 --> 00:19:19,409 Long time no see! Good to see you, sir! 415 00:19:19,409 --> 00:19:22,120 But, in this community, 416 00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:24,623 we have overall been very accepted. 417 00:19:24,623 --> 00:19:26,667 [indistinct chatter] 418 00:19:27,292 --> 00:19:29,086 HEATHER: I just didn't think anything of it. 419 00:19:29,086 --> 00:19:30,587 I was just like, oh, there are two guys over there. 420 00:19:30,587 --> 00:19:31,421 And I was like, okay. 421 00:19:31,421 --> 00:19:33,131 And I was like, well, maybe they're roommates. 422 00:19:33,131 --> 00:19:35,092 I mean, I didn't know, you know? 423 00:19:35,092 --> 00:19:37,803 And I was like, or they could be together. Okay, whatever. 424 00:19:37,803 --> 00:19:39,012 [indistinct chatter] 425 00:19:39,012 --> 00:19:41,765 MARIO: Our neighbors, they're great people. 426 00:19:41,765 --> 00:19:42,808 MONTE: We've never asked them, 427 00:19:43,892 --> 00:19:47,396 I guess, why they've taken such a liking to us, 428 00:19:47,396 --> 00:19:48,814 which is so polar opposite 429 00:19:48,814 --> 00:19:51,859 of what we believe that they support. 430 00:19:51,859 --> 00:19:55,904 When we know a person that votes for Trump, it's like, well, 431 00:19:55,904 --> 00:19:58,073 he stands against everything that we are. - Anti-LGBT, yeah. [laughs] 432 00:19:59,241 --> 00:20:02,995 MONTE: We're so polar opposite, but it is what it is. 433 00:20:02,995 --> 00:20:04,872 I mean, we trust them enough 434 00:20:04,872 --> 00:20:07,583 to watch our house, and they trust us to watch their house, 435 00:20:07,583 --> 00:20:10,335 and Mario gives their kid piano lessons, 436 00:20:10,335 --> 00:20:12,379 and I-I don't know how to explain it. 437 00:20:12,379 --> 00:20:15,632 ♪ playing piano ♪ 438 00:20:15,632 --> 00:20:17,968 Okay, almost. We're gonna hit the first chord twice. 439 00:20:17,968 --> 00:20:19,511 - Oh, right. - Yeah, you got it. Ready? 440 00:20:19,511 --> 00:20:23,056 One, two, three, and... [snapping fingers] 441 00:20:23,056 --> 00:20:26,393 ♪ playing piano ♪ 442 00:20:26,393 --> 00:20:28,729 Okay! Dun-dun, down. 443 00:20:28,729 --> 00:20:30,105 KORY: We're not in their position. 444 00:20:30,105 --> 00:20:31,523 I can't put myself in their shoes, 445 00:20:31,523 --> 00:20:33,525 but all I can do is, you know, 446 00:20:33,525 --> 00:20:36,278 love on them the way they love on us, and they're great neighbors. 447 00:20:36,278 --> 00:20:39,281 ♪ playing piano ♪ 448 00:20:43,660 --> 00:20:45,162 [inaudible] 449 00:20:45,162 --> 00:20:48,916 MARIO: I just keep rolling with my life. 450 00:20:48,916 --> 00:20:52,377 [laughs] You know, the church thing, keep rolling. 451 00:20:52,377 --> 00:20:55,088 Air Force thing came up, keep rolling. 452 00:20:55,088 --> 00:20:57,799 ♪ 453 00:20:57,799 --> 00:20:59,968 I'm still waiting for, 454 00:20:59,968 --> 00:21:01,720 you know, something. Something's gonna happen. 455 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:03,805 I don't know when or what's gonna happen. 456 00:21:03,805 --> 00:21:05,516 - Like is it too good to be true? - Right. 457 00:21:13,941 --> 00:21:17,152 ♪ 458 00:21:17,152 --> 00:21:19,947 [inaudible] 459 00:21:19,947 --> 00:21:22,407 COURTNEY: We have always wanted to have land, 460 00:21:22,407 --> 00:21:26,161 and we wanted to be closer to our food. 461 00:21:26,161 --> 00:21:27,412 DENISE: And we wanted goats. 462 00:21:27,412 --> 00:21:29,665 [goats bleating] 463 00:21:29,665 --> 00:21:33,460 MAREK: It's such a weird combination that a lot of people don't think of. 464 00:21:33,460 --> 00:21:36,880 Farming, and then ranching goats, and then also being 465 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:38,382 a same-sex couple. 466 00:21:39,925 --> 00:21:42,636 DENISE: We get a lot of backhanded compliments. 467 00:21:42,636 --> 00:21:44,221 [laughs] - So I guess living in the Midwest, 468 00:21:44,221 --> 00:21:47,391 a backhanded compliment at times is like, well... 469 00:21:47,391 --> 00:21:49,643 we're doing our job. [Denise laughs] 470 00:21:49,643 --> 00:21:51,228 We're integrating. 471 00:21:51,228 --> 00:21:54,731 [rooster crowing] [goats bleating] 472 00:21:58,318 --> 00:22:02,531 Midwesterners have a way of living 473 00:22:02,531 --> 00:22:06,368 that is like having a horse with blinders on. 474 00:22:06,368 --> 00:22:10,038 I can't tell you the number of people that I have met 475 00:22:10,038 --> 00:22:13,625 that they have never left 476 00:22:13,625 --> 00:22:15,752 the town they grew up in. 477 00:22:15,752 --> 00:22:18,714 Marek was born in Kansas. 478 00:22:19,464 --> 00:22:23,051 And he was still seen as an outsider because we didn't own the house 479 00:22:23,051 --> 00:22:26,221 that we lived in for three generations. 480 00:22:26,221 --> 00:22:29,099 ♪ 481 00:22:29,099 --> 00:22:31,018 [goats bleating] 482 00:22:31,018 --> 00:22:32,811 Kinda like a ballet. 483 00:22:36,648 --> 00:22:38,442 You know, I lived in New York, 484 00:22:38,442 --> 00:22:40,068 I've lived in Portland, Oregon, 485 00:22:40,068 --> 00:22:42,362 I've lived in Austin, Texas, 486 00:22:42,362 --> 00:22:46,158 and here, a lot of the... 487 00:22:46,158 --> 00:22:47,993 western women 488 00:22:48,619 --> 00:22:50,996 give a very, very... 489 00:22:50,996 --> 00:22:53,207 - Masculine vibe. - Yes. 490 00:22:53,207 --> 00:22:55,292 That's an excellent way to put it. Thank you. 491 00:22:56,418 --> 00:22:59,463 People just assume that I'm a horse girl. 492 00:22:59,463 --> 00:23:01,798 And then Courtney, you know, again, 493 00:23:01,798 --> 00:23:04,092 when Courtney just dresses how Courtney does, 494 00:23:04,092 --> 00:23:06,595 people just glance over... 495 00:23:06,595 --> 00:23:09,640 [goats bleat] ...and think that she's my guy. 496 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,893 So [laughs], we just let them make their assumptions. 497 00:23:12,893 --> 00:23:14,228 Yeah, it doesn't really matter. 498 00:23:14,228 --> 00:23:16,772 And it's been like that my whole life, so. - Yeah. 499 00:23:16,772 --> 00:23:18,565 I'm like, whatever. [laughs] 500 00:23:18,565 --> 00:23:20,609 ♪ 501 00:23:20,609 --> 00:23:22,778 DENISE: We met in Lawrence. 502 00:23:22,778 --> 00:23:25,197 Couple of dates, and then we were living together. 503 00:23:25,197 --> 00:23:27,449 So, it was like first date, the toothbrush, 504 00:23:27,449 --> 00:23:28,992 second date, the U-Haul. 505 00:23:29,785 --> 00:23:33,413 And then, we knew within the first year 506 00:23:33,413 --> 00:23:36,291 that we wanted to move out of town to the country. 507 00:23:36,291 --> 00:23:39,294 ♪ 508 00:23:40,838 --> 00:23:43,465 [inaudible] 509 00:23:44,675 --> 00:23:46,385 MAREK: Whoa. 510 00:23:47,928 --> 00:23:50,722 DENISE: I always, always, always wanted a baby. 511 00:23:50,722 --> 00:23:53,767 [laughs] When I was little, I wanted a baby. 512 00:23:53,767 --> 00:23:55,936 As I got older, I wanted a baby. 513 00:23:55,936 --> 00:23:58,021 I was like, let's see where it goes. [laughs] 514 00:23:58,021 --> 00:24:00,274 I was like, okay, I'm in. 515 00:24:01,817 --> 00:24:04,111 Marek is kind 516 00:24:04,778 --> 00:24:07,906 and giving and empathetic 517 00:24:08,532 --> 00:24:10,909 and he helps center us. 518 00:24:10,909 --> 00:24:14,538 ♪ 519 00:24:14,538 --> 00:24:17,165 [quiet chatter] [hits cue ball] 520 00:24:17,749 --> 00:24:21,712 COURTNEY: He is so attune 521 00:24:21,712 --> 00:24:24,214 to the environment around him. 522 00:24:24,214 --> 00:24:26,717 He's really gregarious and can plug himself in. 523 00:24:26,717 --> 00:24:29,303 And, like you said, he's a grounding force. 524 00:24:31,221 --> 00:24:33,432 We put him in the art center preschool in Lawrence, 525 00:24:33,432 --> 00:24:35,601 and that was wonderful. - It was amazing. 526 00:24:35,601 --> 00:24:38,020 It was a great program. And so we continued on 527 00:24:38,020 --> 00:24:40,772 with a public schooling mentality 528 00:24:40,772 --> 00:24:43,775 and put him into kindergarten. 529 00:24:43,775 --> 00:24:46,945 MAREK: When I went to public school, it was pretty bad. 530 00:24:46,945 --> 00:24:49,114 Turns out people in a trailer park in the Midwest 531 00:24:49,114 --> 00:24:51,533 don't really like lesbians too much. 532 00:24:51,533 --> 00:24:53,285 At least their parents don't. 533 00:24:53,285 --> 00:24:56,872 And so, I was called a lot of names, 534 00:24:56,872 --> 00:24:58,832 some pretty aggressive bullying. 535 00:24:59,666 --> 00:25:01,752 He would come home and talk about things 536 00:25:01,752 --> 00:25:03,670 that kids would say to him 537 00:25:03,670 --> 00:25:06,924 or interactions he would have on the playground, 538 00:25:06,924 --> 00:25:09,009 and they weren't positive. 539 00:25:09,009 --> 00:25:11,512 And we approached the school 540 00:25:11,512 --> 00:25:13,764 about what happened, 541 00:25:13,764 --> 00:25:16,600 and they basically said, 542 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:19,686 "Well, what do you expect? It's just gonna get worse." 543 00:25:20,604 --> 00:25:23,065 DENISE: Like, I can still remember a dinner conversation 544 00:25:23,065 --> 00:25:25,484 that we had while he was in public school. 545 00:25:25,484 --> 00:25:27,528 It was before gay marriage was legal, 546 00:25:27,528 --> 00:25:31,406 and we were talking about gay marriage, 547 00:25:31,406 --> 00:25:35,369 and our son actually said, 548 00:25:35,369 --> 00:25:37,329 "I don't think it's right. 549 00:25:37,329 --> 00:25:39,748 ♪ 550 00:25:39,748 --> 00:25:41,875 Because it's against the law." 551 00:25:41,875 --> 00:25:45,420 And that was him being influenced directly by 552 00:25:46,046 --> 00:25:49,967 the people in the community 553 00:25:49,967 --> 00:25:52,302 because, obviously, it wasn't us! 554 00:25:52,302 --> 00:25:54,888 It sparked a conversation of 555 00:25:54,888 --> 00:25:58,433 sometimes, laws are not made 556 00:25:58,433 --> 00:26:02,312 by people that have the most... diverse... 557 00:26:03,438 --> 00:26:04,857 point of view. 558 00:26:06,692 --> 00:26:10,320 We took him out of school and put him in 559 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:13,574 a virtual learning environment, where he was able 560 00:26:13,574 --> 00:26:16,618 to make his own schedule and... 561 00:26:17,786 --> 00:26:19,246 explore his own interests. 562 00:26:20,455 --> 00:26:22,916 MAREK: When my parents took me out of public school, 563 00:26:22,916 --> 00:26:25,419 the principal said, 564 00:26:25,419 --> 00:26:27,546 "Oh, you'll be back." 565 00:26:27,546 --> 00:26:30,174 I was not back. So, 566 00:26:30,174 --> 00:26:33,051 that was, at least, a little bit of vindication 567 00:26:33,051 --> 00:26:36,597 that I proved someone wrong at least once in my life. 568 00:26:37,723 --> 00:26:40,809 COURTNEY: He became free 569 00:26:40,809 --> 00:26:43,103 to be who he wants to be 570 00:26:43,103 --> 00:26:45,480 without fear of repercussions. 571 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:46,857 ♪ 572 00:26:46,857 --> 00:26:48,817 MAREK: A theater kid might, to some people, 573 00:26:48,817 --> 00:26:50,527 have negative connotations, 574 00:26:50,527 --> 00:26:52,863 but just doing theater and being in that sphere 575 00:26:52,863 --> 00:26:54,656 and not being annoying about it 576 00:26:54,656 --> 00:26:58,202 and not forcing it on other people is great. 577 00:26:58,202 --> 00:27:01,413 Like, you clearly have a passion and a drive to do it, 578 00:27:01,413 --> 00:27:03,665 and you feel 579 00:27:03,665 --> 00:27:06,460 like that's what you wanna do with your life, 580 00:27:06,460 --> 00:27:07,753 which is what I wanna do with my life. 581 00:27:09,296 --> 00:27:11,798 Basically, these Tow here... - Okay. 582 00:27:11,798 --> 00:27:13,884 They're getting ambushed by the Imperium of Man. 583 00:27:15,010 --> 00:27:15,761 I'm-- 584 00:27:15,761 --> 00:27:17,429 Are we playing D&D with Warhammer minions? 585 00:27:17,429 --> 00:27:20,849 Sure, you could say that, so... [laughs] 586 00:27:20,849 --> 00:27:23,644 Yeah, you're gonna have a great time, I'm sure. 587 00:27:24,394 --> 00:27:27,189 I feel like if I didn't have lesbian parents, 588 00:27:27,189 --> 00:27:29,942 I would probably be a little bit more close-minded. 589 00:27:29,942 --> 00:27:31,527 I would definitely not be 590 00:27:31,527 --> 00:27:34,446 as open about myself. 591 00:27:36,490 --> 00:27:39,826 I'm bisexual, so I like both genders. [birds chirping] 592 00:27:39,826 --> 00:27:43,205 I just look like a guy in the Midwest 593 00:27:43,205 --> 00:27:46,291 where outer appearance is a lot. 594 00:27:46,291 --> 00:27:49,586 It's really easy to just not say anything and have people 595 00:27:49,586 --> 00:27:51,547 make assumptions, and whether those be good 596 00:27:51,547 --> 00:27:53,173 or bad assumptions is up to them. 597 00:27:55,384 --> 00:27:57,511 [rumbling] 598 00:27:57,511 --> 00:27:59,888 I certainly share some Midwestern values. 599 00:27:59,888 --> 00:28:02,516 I feel like I'm polite and I'm kind 600 00:28:02,516 --> 00:28:04,643 and I'm here to help. 601 00:28:04,643 --> 00:28:08,188 But, I also feel like... 602 00:28:09,314 --> 00:28:13,277 being accepting and being a general good person 603 00:28:13,277 --> 00:28:16,446 is a lot better than just pretending to be. 604 00:28:16,446 --> 00:28:19,700 ♪ 605 00:28:19,700 --> 00:28:23,245 COURTNEY: The Midwestern culture has an overall resistance 606 00:28:23,245 --> 00:28:27,207 to change and altering the mentality 607 00:28:27,207 --> 00:28:29,960 of what defines 608 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:31,712 a nuclear family. 609 00:28:34,339 --> 00:28:36,341 We are just people living in a community. 610 00:28:37,885 --> 00:28:40,971 And if we're good people, we're good people. 611 00:28:40,971 --> 00:28:44,683 Okay? Because you take a fall gracefully. 612 00:28:44,683 --> 00:28:48,645 And there's nothing different about who we are. 613 00:28:48,645 --> 00:28:51,857 I mean, we're just two parents 614 00:28:51,857 --> 00:28:55,736 and a child growing up in the Midwest. - Mm-hmm. 615 00:28:55,736 --> 00:28:58,488 [Denise laughing] 616 00:28:58,488 --> 00:29:01,950 DENISE: Wait. Fore! [laughs] COURTNEY: Alright... 617 00:29:08,582 --> 00:29:11,335 ♪ 618 00:29:14,588 --> 00:29:17,925 RUSS: First of all, thank you guys for being part of this and joining us today. 619 00:29:17,925 --> 00:29:21,720 What we'd like to do is just kind of get to understand what our-- 620 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,389 what this safe organization is. 621 00:29:24,389 --> 00:29:25,641 ♪ 622 00:29:25,641 --> 00:29:27,893 ANDREW: He commands respect in his classroom. 623 00:29:27,893 --> 00:29:29,061 He's been teaching for, 624 00:29:29,061 --> 00:29:30,896 [laughs] I don't even know, 625 00:29:30,896 --> 00:29:32,856 but far longer than I've been alive, 626 00:29:32,856 --> 00:29:35,108 and everybody knows who he is, 627 00:29:35,108 --> 00:29:37,611 and they respect him for what he is. 628 00:29:37,611 --> 00:29:40,405 Russ was my choir teacher 629 00:29:40,405 --> 00:29:42,115 for all four years of high school. 630 00:29:42,115 --> 00:29:45,202 He was never shy about who he was 631 00:29:45,202 --> 00:29:47,454 and really helped me figure out who I was. 632 00:29:47,454 --> 00:29:49,665 He was the first person in Oak Harbor 633 00:29:49,665 --> 00:29:52,251 who I told about my sexuality 634 00:29:52,251 --> 00:29:55,128 just because he made his classroom a safe space. 635 00:29:57,089 --> 00:29:58,841 RUSS: As an educator for 26 years, 636 00:29:58,841 --> 00:30:02,386 I had students coming to my office all the time, saying, 637 00:30:02,386 --> 00:30:04,346 "Mr. Raber, can I talk to you? Can I talk to you?" 638 00:30:04,346 --> 00:30:07,015 And so, I think sometimes, just by being visible-- 639 00:30:07,015 --> 00:30:09,434 I mean, clearly, my students knew my husband. 640 00:30:09,434 --> 00:30:12,563 - Yeah. - He was visible at school events, 641 00:30:12,563 --> 00:30:15,107 and I think just having that representation for them 642 00:30:15,107 --> 00:30:16,608 was, was very helpful. 643 00:30:17,734 --> 00:30:21,071 MARK: I came out in 1995, so I have seen it go 644 00:30:21,071 --> 00:30:24,032 from just the very beginning, 645 00:30:24,032 --> 00:30:27,911 to, I mean, where marriage was legal in the state of Ohio. 646 00:30:27,911 --> 00:30:30,080 In 2012, when we got married, 647 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,166 we had to get married in New York state because we couldn't get married here yet. 648 00:30:33,166 --> 00:30:34,877 But, it has changed so much. 649 00:30:34,877 --> 00:30:37,045 Then all of a sudden, 2016 came, 650 00:30:37,045 --> 00:30:39,882 and it's almost like we went backwards. - Mm-hmm. 651 00:30:39,882 --> 00:30:41,925 ♪ 652 00:30:41,925 --> 00:30:44,052 VIN: The students and their homophobia and hate. 653 00:30:45,387 --> 00:30:48,140 This one kid believes 654 00:30:48,140 --> 00:30:50,100 that non-binary people do not exist. 655 00:30:50,100 --> 00:30:52,436 It's only two, the gender binary. 656 00:30:52,436 --> 00:30:54,479 I mean, I'm here right now, 657 00:30:54,479 --> 00:30:57,024 [laughs] so we do kinda exist. 658 00:30:59,276 --> 00:31:01,862 RUSS: I very much believe that the bullying 659 00:31:01,862 --> 00:31:03,739 has sort of reemerged 660 00:31:03,739 --> 00:31:07,159 as a hot topic for LGBTQ+ students. 661 00:31:07,159 --> 00:31:09,286 I think it's more subversive. 662 00:31:10,621 --> 00:31:13,040 It's now 2022, 663 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:16,627 and I feel like Oak Harbor, as a, as a collective unit, 664 00:31:16,627 --> 00:31:20,422 is just sort of coming into the 1998 frame of mind. 665 00:31:20,422 --> 00:31:22,925 Trying to combat that 666 00:31:22,925 --> 00:31:24,927 generational mindset 667 00:31:24,927 --> 00:31:28,013 is difficult because change is difficult for people. 668 00:31:28,013 --> 00:31:31,808 But, when kids' lives, you know, are on the table, 669 00:31:31,808 --> 00:31:32,851 you have to make the change. 670 00:31:35,312 --> 00:31:38,690 I came out at a later age, and my family was amazing. 671 00:31:38,690 --> 00:31:41,318 And I, I give them credit. 672 00:31:42,361 --> 00:31:45,531 I like to say my father is not necessarily an educated man, 673 00:31:45,531 --> 00:31:48,784 but he's truly one of the wisest people I know. He truly is. 674 00:31:48,784 --> 00:31:52,287 And he has embraced Mark like a son. MARK: Oh yeah. 675 00:31:53,330 --> 00:31:55,791 My coming out was different. 676 00:31:55,791 --> 00:31:58,126 I threw myself into college, 677 00:31:58,126 --> 00:32:01,922 and I came out in college in Kent, Ohio, 678 00:32:01,922 --> 00:32:03,423 and kind of resigned myself 679 00:32:03,423 --> 00:32:05,801 that this was the decision I was gonna make, 680 00:32:05,801 --> 00:32:09,221 but I knew my family of Greek descent 681 00:32:09,221 --> 00:32:11,765 was not probably gonna do well with it. 682 00:32:11,765 --> 00:32:14,601 Now, am I angry with my parents? No. No, no, no. 683 00:32:14,601 --> 00:32:18,230 They have become amazing, amazing advocates for me, 684 00:32:18,230 --> 00:32:21,441 and I never had to worry about them abandoning me. 685 00:32:21,441 --> 00:32:23,610 That is an amazing feeling. 686 00:32:23,610 --> 00:32:27,072 Now, I'm horrified for people that don't have that. 687 00:32:27,072 --> 00:32:30,075 ♪ playing accordion ♪ 688 00:32:34,496 --> 00:32:38,458 ANDREW: I probably say that I realized I was bisexual a few years ago. 689 00:32:39,543 --> 00:32:43,130 At first, I didn't really feel comfortable telling anybody and... 690 00:32:44,173 --> 00:32:46,466 and then, when I did feel comfortable telling, it was mainly 691 00:32:46,466 --> 00:32:49,928 just my friends. And then just recently, I told her. 692 00:32:49,928 --> 00:32:52,097 ♪ playing accordion ♪ 693 00:32:52,097 --> 00:32:54,057 APRIL: I'm kind of, you know, 694 00:32:54,057 --> 00:32:55,934 trying to play it by ear. 695 00:32:55,934 --> 00:32:59,438 My big thing was when he told me, he was gonna let it up to me 696 00:32:59,438 --> 00:33:01,106 and to use my judgment. 697 00:33:01,106 --> 00:33:03,817 It was a big struggle for me only because 698 00:33:03,817 --> 00:33:06,195 there are a few people in our family that 699 00:33:07,487 --> 00:33:09,698 their reactions could go either way. 700 00:33:09,698 --> 00:33:13,035 And I'm leery of subjecting him 701 00:33:13,035 --> 00:33:16,955 to any kind of undue criticism 702 00:33:16,955 --> 00:33:18,457 from a family member. 703 00:33:18,457 --> 00:33:21,460 ♪ playing accordion ♪ 704 00:33:27,299 --> 00:33:31,261 VIN: My name Vin comes from a little bit of a story. 705 00:33:32,429 --> 00:33:35,432 Around 2020, early 2021, 706 00:33:35,432 --> 00:33:37,017 I thought I was trans. 707 00:33:38,018 --> 00:33:41,313 And so, I wanted to go with something 708 00:33:41,313 --> 00:33:44,942 along the lines of my legal name, Marin. 709 00:33:44,942 --> 00:33:47,402 So, I went with the name Marvin. 710 00:33:48,445 --> 00:33:50,781 And so, I started thinking a bit more. I was like, 711 00:33:50,781 --> 00:33:53,659 yeah, I don't really feel like a man. 712 00:33:54,910 --> 00:33:57,496 Let's chop off that Mar and just stick with Vin. 713 00:33:57,496 --> 00:33:59,331 And now, a friend calls me Vinny. 714 00:33:59,331 --> 00:34:01,083 ♪ 715 00:34:01,083 --> 00:34:03,168 SARAH: The changing of her name 716 00:34:03,168 --> 00:34:05,170 was very tough. Um... 717 00:34:08,131 --> 00:34:10,467 It almost felt like she was... 718 00:34:11,009 --> 00:34:14,221 throwing things away. Oh, my God, I'm sorry. [sniffles] 719 00:34:14,930 --> 00:34:15,931 [gasps] 720 00:34:18,225 --> 00:34:19,601 And it just felt like 721 00:34:19,601 --> 00:34:22,855 maybe I did something to make her wanna change. 722 00:34:24,106 --> 00:34:25,899 But I didn't. 723 00:34:25,899 --> 00:34:27,359 I was the one who did that. 724 00:34:27,359 --> 00:34:30,904 And now I feel, excuse me, much better 725 00:34:30,904 --> 00:34:33,740 about it, that they're not throwing 726 00:34:33,740 --> 00:34:35,951 their childhood away. 727 00:34:35,951 --> 00:34:37,286 That it wasn't that. 728 00:34:37,286 --> 00:34:39,830 No, it's just different. 729 00:34:39,830 --> 00:34:42,124 And it's hard for me to understand sometimes 730 00:34:42,124 --> 00:34:45,419 because I don't understand. 731 00:34:45,419 --> 00:34:47,171 But I want to. 732 00:34:48,255 --> 00:34:51,258 VIN: What I have done in Safe, personally, 733 00:34:51,258 --> 00:34:54,386 is feel more confident in myself. Like I can... 734 00:34:54,386 --> 00:34:57,055 Like I meet a new person. "Hi, my name is Vin." 735 00:34:57,055 --> 00:34:59,725 RUSS: Students advocating for equality, 736 00:34:59,725 --> 00:35:02,144 LGBTQ students, racial minorities, 737 00:35:02,144 --> 00:35:04,104 disability minorities, you name it. 738 00:35:04,104 --> 00:35:06,523 Even people who are in the community... 739 00:35:06,523 --> 00:35:09,610 RUSS: But they have grown and really helped 740 00:35:09,610 --> 00:35:11,612 to support students 741 00:35:11,612 --> 00:35:13,697 in that community and surrounding communities. 742 00:35:13,697 --> 00:35:16,033 And I just can't speak enough about it. It's amazing. 743 00:35:16,033 --> 00:35:18,452 ANDREW: We're making people aware of us. 744 00:35:18,452 --> 00:35:20,329 We're also making it apparent 745 00:35:20,329 --> 00:35:23,624 that like there is a group where you can come to 746 00:35:23,624 --> 00:35:26,418 if you wanna come out, or if you don't feel safe, 747 00:35:26,418 --> 00:35:28,587 there is a group you can come to and talk about it 748 00:35:28,587 --> 00:35:30,339 and join us, stuff like that. 749 00:35:30,339 --> 00:35:32,466 You're not alone because we have this group 750 00:35:32,466 --> 00:35:33,926 here Oak, like in Oak Harbor. 751 00:35:33,926 --> 00:35:35,552 ♪ 752 00:35:35,552 --> 00:35:37,846 RUSS: I look back on past graduates 753 00:35:37,846 --> 00:35:40,682 who you would see them struggle, 754 00:35:40,682 --> 00:35:44,436 kinda come to their identity, and then once they've graduated, 755 00:35:44,436 --> 00:35:47,189 your, your relationship with them changes. 756 00:35:47,189 --> 00:35:50,192 Just having that representation for them 757 00:35:50,192 --> 00:35:51,944 was very helpful, 758 00:35:51,944 --> 00:35:54,738 and I kinda heard some of those stories 759 00:35:54,738 --> 00:35:56,573 after they graduated. 760 00:36:01,495 --> 00:36:02,663 TAYLOR: I do love this community, 761 00:36:02,663 --> 00:36:05,040 but I wanted to expand my horizons a little bit. 762 00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:08,418 I wanted to kind of explore new things, new cities. 763 00:36:08,418 --> 00:36:11,672 So I did tell myself that I wasn't going to permanently come back here, 764 00:36:11,672 --> 00:36:13,757 but I ended up coming back. 765 00:36:13,757 --> 00:36:16,760 I am a third grade special education teacher. 766 00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,011 ♪ 767 00:36:18,011 --> 00:36:20,639 The parents don't know my sexuality, 768 00:36:20,639 --> 00:36:23,559 and because of that small-town stigma, 769 00:36:23,559 --> 00:36:26,270 I never know what parents might think about that. 770 00:36:26,270 --> 00:36:28,981 Maybe they might think less of me as a teacher, 771 00:36:28,981 --> 00:36:32,568 that I'm not as equipped to be a teacher. 772 00:36:33,318 --> 00:36:34,695 I'd come to realize that, 773 00:36:34,695 --> 00:36:36,238 no, I want to do this 774 00:36:36,238 --> 00:36:38,699 because I want people to understand 775 00:36:38,699 --> 00:36:39,908 that we are teachers, 776 00:36:39,908 --> 00:36:41,910 we are doctors, and food service workers, 777 00:36:41,910 --> 00:36:43,745 and we're your everyday people, 778 00:36:43,745 --> 00:36:46,290 and we are good people just like you. 779 00:36:47,291 --> 00:36:48,292 [laughter] 780 00:36:48,292 --> 00:36:50,711 Can't believe that's what actually brought us back together as friends. 781 00:36:50,711 --> 00:36:52,921 I know! We were happen to run into each other 782 00:36:52,921 --> 00:36:54,756 after how long of not talking. 783 00:36:54,756 --> 00:36:56,341 We kind of lost touch for a while. 784 00:36:56,341 --> 00:36:57,801 Over a little bit over the summer. 785 00:36:57,801 --> 00:37:00,762 TAYLOR: Greg has been my best friend since sixth grade. 786 00:37:00,762 --> 00:37:03,390 Our freshman year of college, we were out to lunch. 787 00:37:03,390 --> 00:37:05,767 It had been a while since we had talked to each other. 788 00:37:05,767 --> 00:37:08,061 And then, I was like, "What about your love life? 789 00:37:08,061 --> 00:37:09,813 Do you have anybody in your life?" 790 00:37:09,813 --> 00:37:11,857 And he said, "Actually, yes I do." 791 00:37:11,857 --> 00:37:13,400 "Oh, okay, what's her name?" 792 00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:17,237 And he said, "Actually, his name is..." And that's when-- 793 00:37:17,237 --> 00:37:19,156 That's how he came out to me. 794 00:37:19,156 --> 00:37:21,742 She was one of the first girls I started-- ever dated. 795 00:37:21,742 --> 00:37:25,329 She was my first kiss before I even knew who I was. 796 00:37:25,329 --> 00:37:27,831 I think it definitely brought us closer. It gave us... 797 00:37:27,831 --> 00:37:31,585 GREG: My dad has not been in my life for about three years now. 798 00:37:31,585 --> 00:37:33,212 As soon as I came out, 799 00:37:33,212 --> 00:37:37,174 he kind of started distancing and cutting himself off, 800 00:37:37,174 --> 00:37:41,136 until eventually to the point where we just kind of went our separate ways. 801 00:37:43,263 --> 00:37:45,224 Do you remember how that happened? How that conversation went down? 802 00:37:45,224 --> 00:37:47,100 I absolutely have no idea. [Taylor laughs] 803 00:37:47,100 --> 00:37:49,895 We're all gonna find the people who don't support us 804 00:37:49,895 --> 00:37:52,481 and don't accept us as who we are, 805 00:37:52,481 --> 00:37:55,400 but there's going to be your biggest cheerleader in your corner. 806 00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:56,985 You just have to figure out who that is, 807 00:37:56,985 --> 00:37:59,404 whether it's your mom, your dad, your best friend. 808 00:37:59,404 --> 00:38:01,698 Did we ever even break up? Are we still dating and I didn't know it? 809 00:38:01,698 --> 00:38:04,284 Absolutely not. [laughs] [laughs] 810 00:38:04,284 --> 00:38:07,788 [birds chirping] [quiet street noise] 811 00:38:08,956 --> 00:38:11,750 RUSS: I am currently creating centerpieces 812 00:38:11,750 --> 00:38:13,418 for our queer prom coming up soon. 813 00:38:13,418 --> 00:38:17,339 So, we have a local... 814 00:38:17,339 --> 00:38:18,966 party supply store in town 815 00:38:18,966 --> 00:38:21,927 who's doing a large rainbow balloon arch. 816 00:38:22,970 --> 00:38:25,848 Gay marriage did not solve everything. MARK: No, it did not. 817 00:38:25,848 --> 00:38:27,808 There is still incredible amounts of homophobia, 818 00:38:27,808 --> 00:38:30,853 biphobia, transphobia, every phobia under the sun. 819 00:38:30,853 --> 00:38:32,729 ♪ 820 00:38:32,729 --> 00:38:35,816 MARK: We need to work as a country on communication. 821 00:38:35,816 --> 00:38:38,402 Not just in small towns. Everywhere. 822 00:38:38,402 --> 00:38:40,821 [inaudible] 823 00:38:41,321 --> 00:38:44,533 RUSS: For the last several years, we were bombarded with these negative messages. 824 00:38:45,993 --> 00:38:47,786 On the backside of that messaging, 825 00:38:47,786 --> 00:38:49,955 it's so vital to have a safe space 826 00:38:49,955 --> 00:38:52,958 where kids have the opposite message. 827 00:38:52,958 --> 00:38:55,961 [inaudible] 828 00:39:02,718 --> 00:39:04,553 REP. HEATHER KEELER: It's amazing to me, 829 00:39:04,553 --> 00:39:07,139 as a public elected official, 830 00:39:07,139 --> 00:39:10,434 the amount of threats I get 831 00:39:10,434 --> 00:39:13,312 just for serving in the capacity of who I am. 832 00:39:13,312 --> 00:39:15,898 No, they're not mad at me for the bills that I'm presenting. 833 00:39:15,898 --> 00:39:16,899 They're mad at me 834 00:39:16,899 --> 00:39:19,526 because I'm an indigenous queer woman sitting at the table, 835 00:39:19,526 --> 00:39:22,613 and the death threats that come with that 836 00:39:22,613 --> 00:39:26,283 show that people are still shook that we're here. 837 00:39:26,283 --> 00:39:27,826 ♪ 838 00:39:27,826 --> 00:39:28,869 Okay. 839 00:39:28,869 --> 00:39:31,079 Wait, did you ever get a meeting? 840 00:39:31,079 --> 00:39:32,456 No. Did you? 841 00:39:32,456 --> 00:39:34,875 No, with Logan's Laws. Let's follow up on Logan's Laws... 842 00:39:34,875 --> 00:39:38,754 We're seeing a shift in who our political leaders are 843 00:39:38,754 --> 00:39:41,298 in Minnesota, but I think also across the nation, 844 00:39:41,298 --> 00:39:43,926 is that we're coming in as grassroots organizers. 845 00:39:43,926 --> 00:39:46,887 We're coming in as individuals who haven't seen ourselves 846 00:39:46,887 --> 00:39:48,305 represented in this space. 847 00:39:48,305 --> 00:39:51,433 And so the fact that it's three freshmen 848 00:39:51,433 --> 00:39:54,478 leading this LGBTQ conversation, 849 00:39:54,478 --> 00:39:56,522 um, is really fun. 850 00:39:56,522 --> 00:39:59,525 [assembly chatter] 851 00:40:04,238 --> 00:40:06,114 I'm not in this work for politics. 852 00:40:06,114 --> 00:40:08,659 I'm in this work for people, 853 00:40:08,659 --> 00:40:11,328 and I was sick of seeing this world 854 00:40:11,328 --> 00:40:13,664 be so harmful to people like me. 855 00:40:13,664 --> 00:40:15,707 And I didn't wanna just be a mom 856 00:40:15,707 --> 00:40:17,376 that vented on social media. 857 00:40:17,376 --> 00:40:21,088 I wanted to be a mom that could look my kids in the eyes and say 858 00:40:21,088 --> 00:40:24,716 I actively did everything I could to make this world a better place for you. 859 00:40:24,716 --> 00:40:26,176 [indistinct chatter] 860 00:40:26,176 --> 00:40:28,095 And so, I wanted to figure out how to get at bigger tables 861 00:40:28,095 --> 00:40:31,807 and I figured out in this world, it's all about degrees. 862 00:40:31,807 --> 00:40:35,769 So went on, got my master's in educational leadership. 863 00:40:35,769 --> 00:40:38,021 Professionally, I went from sitting in living rooms, 864 00:40:38,021 --> 00:40:40,858 talking to my families, building really nice relationships 865 00:40:40,858 --> 00:40:43,944 to then taking all of those tools and that pain that I heard 866 00:40:43,944 --> 00:40:45,779 and turning it into policy and purpose. 867 00:40:45,779 --> 00:40:48,907 [indistinct prayer] 868 00:40:48,907 --> 00:40:52,786 Marriage equality did a lot for us. 869 00:40:52,786 --> 00:40:55,330 I think though now we're missing 870 00:40:55,330 --> 00:40:58,625 the acceptance of the family structure. 871 00:40:58,625 --> 00:41:01,378 What our legal rights are with families. 872 00:41:02,838 --> 00:41:05,507 You know I think we have a long ways to go to be really accepting there. 873 00:41:05,507 --> 00:41:07,342 ♪ 874 00:41:07,342 --> 00:41:09,344 And I think if we can work in our school systems 875 00:41:09,344 --> 00:41:11,430 and in those younger spaces to be more loving 876 00:41:11,430 --> 00:41:14,266 and accepting of all kinds of families, 877 00:41:14,266 --> 00:41:18,020 we teach our next generation to be more kind and inclusive 878 00:41:18,020 --> 00:41:20,772 to each other, and that's how we really make the shift. 879 00:41:32,242 --> 00:41:35,245 ♪ 880 00:41:37,748 --> 00:41:41,376 [mall chatter] 881 00:41:42,794 --> 00:41:45,255 JENN: Transitioning is a huge undertaking, 882 00:41:45,255 --> 00:41:47,925 and it's not for the faint of heart by any means. 883 00:41:49,259 --> 00:41:51,803 Even though you're the same person, now, all of a sudden, 884 00:41:51,803 --> 00:41:53,972 you have kind of a new beginning. 885 00:41:53,972 --> 00:41:57,059 And your voice is different 886 00:41:57,059 --> 00:41:58,185 because you're happy. 887 00:41:58,185 --> 00:42:00,270 You're excited. You're finally living your truth. 888 00:42:00,270 --> 00:42:02,272 You're, you're free. 889 00:42:02,272 --> 00:42:05,692 [indistinct chatter] 890 00:42:05,692 --> 00:42:09,112 MIKAYLA: It kind of feels like our dad never really existed. 891 00:42:09,112 --> 00:42:11,281 Not only were our parents getting divorced, 892 00:42:11,281 --> 00:42:12,908 so we were losing our dad that way. 893 00:42:13,951 --> 00:42:15,786 She, at the time, he, 894 00:42:15,786 --> 00:42:19,456 she left, and then, when we met her again, 895 00:42:19,456 --> 00:42:22,209 she was a woman, and it was completely different. 896 00:42:22,209 --> 00:42:25,170 It felt like we were realistically meeting a stranger. 897 00:42:25,170 --> 00:42:28,048 How does it look, though? DEBB: Eh, it's alright. 898 00:42:28,048 --> 00:42:30,926 ♪ 899 00:42:30,926 --> 00:42:34,096 JENN: We met online, just as platonic friends. 900 00:42:35,305 --> 00:42:38,976 I had a big space and had a vacant room available. 901 00:42:38,976 --> 00:42:42,980 Um, Debb was obviously separating from her ex at the time 902 00:42:42,980 --> 00:42:45,232 and needed a place, so I offered it up. 903 00:42:46,900 --> 00:42:49,069 DEBB: She had an enthusiasm for life 904 00:42:49,069 --> 00:42:52,072 that was something I was not used to seeing. 905 00:42:53,031 --> 00:42:56,326 And it was just very attractive to me. 906 00:42:57,744 --> 00:43:01,665 JENN: We connected on a friendship level that was very difficult to... 907 00:43:03,542 --> 00:43:04,960 explain. 908 00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:07,171 I'd never really had that connection with somebody else. 909 00:43:07,171 --> 00:43:09,173 [street noise] 910 00:43:09,173 --> 00:43:12,301 DEBB: Three years in July. Yeah. JENN: Right. 911 00:43:12,301 --> 00:43:14,136 We set up right over there. - Uh-huh. 912 00:43:14,136 --> 00:43:16,722 This is where Dad met me with the... 913 00:43:16,722 --> 00:43:18,599 [sniffs] the things. - Right. 914 00:43:19,516 --> 00:43:22,853 Pre-wedding enjoyment in tears. 915 00:43:22,853 --> 00:43:25,314 ♪ 916 00:43:25,314 --> 00:43:28,192 DEBB: My dad has come a long way, actually, 917 00:43:28,192 --> 00:43:31,320 but my sons, I believe, 918 00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:33,739 are wildly transphobic. 919 00:43:33,739 --> 00:43:35,032 Just the other day, 920 00:43:35,032 --> 00:43:37,826 I was talking to my ex-wife, and... 921 00:43:38,660 --> 00:43:42,414 I don't know if this is true, but, according to her, 922 00:43:42,414 --> 00:43:45,542 my younger son allegedly said that he would... 923 00:43:46,084 --> 00:43:49,796 kill me if he got the opportunity. 924 00:43:52,883 --> 00:43:54,259 JENN: Met a girl in college. 925 00:43:54,259 --> 00:43:56,428 We ended up getting married about a year and a half 926 00:43:56,428 --> 00:43:59,515 or two years after college, and we started a family together. 927 00:43:59,515 --> 00:44:03,435 My youngest daughter was born in October, 928 00:44:03,435 --> 00:44:06,313 and in early January, February, 929 00:44:06,313 --> 00:44:09,358 I sought out my first gender counselor. 930 00:44:10,317 --> 00:44:13,320 I needed to find out what it all meant because the feelings 931 00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:16,448 that I had suppressed for a decade and a half 932 00:44:16,448 --> 00:44:18,033 had all of a sudden come back. 933 00:44:18,033 --> 00:44:19,368 ♪ 934 00:44:19,368 --> 00:44:22,746 I was diagnosed with gender identity disorder. 935 00:44:24,164 --> 00:44:26,625 At the same point, 936 00:44:26,625 --> 00:44:30,587 because I was hiding this secret, 937 00:44:30,587 --> 00:44:33,173 my marriage started to break down because I wasn't honest. 938 00:44:33,173 --> 00:44:37,135 I didn't know the words to tell my ex-wife... 939 00:44:38,595 --> 00:44:40,347 You know, how do you explain something to somebody 940 00:44:40,347 --> 00:44:42,766 when you really don't know how to explain it to yourself yet? 941 00:44:45,060 --> 00:44:48,856 TRICIA: There were signs, and we had talked about it, 942 00:44:48,856 --> 00:44:51,149 and there were a lot of lies that came out of it. 943 00:44:51,149 --> 00:44:54,528 And so, there was never really any truth to the whole situation. 944 00:44:54,528 --> 00:44:57,072 We would have a fight or an argument 945 00:44:57,072 --> 00:44:59,908 about me being trans. [Debb sniffles] 946 00:44:59,908 --> 00:45:02,369 It, a lot of time, carried over. 947 00:45:02,369 --> 00:45:06,039 We were not real good at shielding 948 00:45:06,039 --> 00:45:09,084 our disagreements from, from my daughters. 949 00:45:09,084 --> 00:45:11,837 ♪ 950 00:45:11,837 --> 00:45:13,839 MIKAYLA: I feel like a lot of people ask, "How is she? 951 00:45:13,839 --> 00:45:15,215 What she's going through?" 952 00:45:15,215 --> 00:45:18,802 They don't realize the impact it takes on not only me and my sister, 953 00:45:18,802 --> 00:45:21,972 but like my mom and my dad's parents. 954 00:45:21,972 --> 00:45:24,057 Everything like that. It's just... 955 00:45:24,057 --> 00:45:27,644 It's a lot for everyone around my dad, 956 00:45:27,644 --> 00:45:30,147 and that's the part that people don't realize. 957 00:45:30,147 --> 00:45:32,482 Their father and I separated, 958 00:45:32,482 --> 00:45:35,694 and we, basically, 959 00:45:35,694 --> 00:45:38,572 were kind of left with nothing. 960 00:45:38,572 --> 00:45:40,073 ♪ 961 00:45:40,073 --> 00:45:43,702 MIKAYLA: When she left, and we lived with our mom, 962 00:45:43,702 --> 00:45:45,287 a single mom who's a teacher, 963 00:45:45,287 --> 00:45:48,040 so it's not like we could afford a house. 964 00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,709 We lived with someone for a year and a half, 965 00:45:50,709 --> 00:45:54,421 and my dad bought this house, lived here, 966 00:45:54,421 --> 00:45:58,050 then met Debb, and had this like happily-ever-after it felt like. 967 00:45:59,426 --> 00:46:02,012 TRICIA: We went from a 4,000-square-foot house 968 00:46:02,012 --> 00:46:04,181 to two bedrooms. 969 00:46:04,181 --> 00:46:06,892 At one point, my kid was bullied at her high school 970 00:46:06,892 --> 00:46:08,602 for being technically homeless 971 00:46:08,602 --> 00:46:11,605 because we didn't have our own home anymore. 972 00:46:12,689 --> 00:46:15,734 EMMA: When the transition happened, when I was in high school, 973 00:46:15,734 --> 00:46:18,153 I didn't know how to explain it. 974 00:46:18,153 --> 00:46:20,697 Like, "Hey, my dad, like--" 975 00:46:20,697 --> 00:46:22,616 There, all my friends are talking about my dad, 976 00:46:22,616 --> 00:46:25,410 but I don't, like, in my head, didn't have one. 977 00:46:29,164 --> 00:46:31,333 [cars flipping] MIKAYLA: No, you get two for nothing, 978 00:46:31,333 --> 00:46:32,793 and then Em got a run of three. 979 00:46:32,793 --> 00:46:35,212 TRICIA: Well, I still can take it. - I was just saying. 980 00:46:35,712 --> 00:46:36,713 Ten. 981 00:46:36,713 --> 00:46:38,340 It made us a lot closer, 982 00:46:38,340 --> 00:46:40,717 so we try to look for the positive parts of it 983 00:46:40,717 --> 00:46:43,846 because we could have definitely thrown the towel in. 984 00:46:44,263 --> 00:46:46,640 Thirty-one. - Four. 985 00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:48,517 TRICIA: We moved into Minneapolis. 986 00:46:48,517 --> 00:46:51,311 We kind of left not only the safe family, 987 00:46:51,311 --> 00:46:54,481 but the safe suburbs, and moved to this big city. 988 00:46:54,481 --> 00:46:57,025 That was a big scary move. 989 00:46:57,025 --> 00:47:00,320 And I think it just made us, all of us, 990 00:47:00,320 --> 00:47:03,115 including my kids, who were quite young at the age, 991 00:47:03,115 --> 00:47:05,075 see that there's other people out there 992 00:47:05,075 --> 00:47:06,577 and other ways of life. 993 00:47:06,577 --> 00:47:08,161 ♪ 994 00:47:08,161 --> 00:47:11,456 JENN: Family-wise, I wasn't expecting to have a relationship 995 00:47:11,456 --> 00:47:15,419 with my ex-wife as friends. I wasn't... 996 00:47:16,420 --> 00:47:18,964 expecting my daughters to be in my life, 997 00:47:18,964 --> 00:47:21,967 and through the work that... 998 00:47:22,551 --> 00:47:25,762 you know, conversations that Deb and I have had 999 00:47:25,762 --> 00:47:28,682 and some of the work that my ex 1000 00:47:28,682 --> 00:47:32,769 was able to do with helping them understand, 1001 00:47:32,769 --> 00:47:35,772 um, we've worked on bringing them back into my life, 1002 00:47:35,772 --> 00:47:39,401 and, and, they're-- they wanna hang out now. 1003 00:47:39,401 --> 00:47:41,278 [indistinct chatter] 1004 00:47:41,278 --> 00:47:42,696 That was a good shot, May. 1005 00:47:44,198 --> 00:47:46,950 TRICIA: I think we're all in a different spot now. 1006 00:47:46,950 --> 00:47:48,660 I can't, I can't say it's perfect. 1007 00:47:48,660 --> 00:47:50,954 Like, life isn't perfect, and things aren't perfect, 1008 00:47:50,954 --> 00:47:52,748 but we're able to... 1009 00:47:54,082 --> 00:47:56,084 be cordial 1010 00:47:56,084 --> 00:47:58,003 and sort of co-parent in a way. 1011 00:47:58,003 --> 00:47:59,254 ♪ 1012 00:47:59,254 --> 00:48:01,256 JENN: So make sure you hit right down in here. 1013 00:48:02,633 --> 00:48:04,676 MIKAYLA: I invited my dad to my sporting events 1014 00:48:04,676 --> 00:48:06,553 for the first time this year, 1015 00:48:06,553 --> 00:48:08,347 and I felt like that really helped. 1016 00:48:08,347 --> 00:48:11,475 That's in the white. That went further than yours. 1017 00:48:11,475 --> 00:48:14,436 Just being able to learn more about a community 1018 00:48:14,436 --> 00:48:16,772 that we didn't necessarily have a part of. 1019 00:48:16,772 --> 00:48:19,191 It wasn't that we were against any kind of community, 1020 00:48:19,191 --> 00:48:20,734 but we didn't know a lot about it. 1021 00:48:21,443 --> 00:48:24,363 So, May did say she's learned a lot more about this community 1022 00:48:24,363 --> 00:48:26,823 and learned how to talk to people about it 1023 00:48:26,823 --> 00:48:29,451 and be more open to accepting others. 1024 00:48:31,161 --> 00:48:33,622 DEBB: Jenn's daughters are my daughters, 1025 00:48:33,622 --> 00:48:35,290 for all intents and purposes. 1026 00:48:36,166 --> 00:48:39,795 They treat me unexpectedly well. 1027 00:48:41,129 --> 00:48:44,591 They were the ones who listened to me 1028 00:48:44,591 --> 00:48:46,844 that I was in the Air Force, 1029 00:48:46,844 --> 00:48:50,389 and then, as a Christmas gift, they made me a blanket 1030 00:48:50,389 --> 00:48:53,308 with Air Force themes on it. 1031 00:48:55,018 --> 00:48:58,313 And it was so touching because someone had actually listened to me, 1032 00:48:58,313 --> 00:49:00,190 and they weren't even related to me. 1033 00:49:00,190 --> 00:49:02,109 [indistinct chatter] 1034 00:49:02,109 --> 00:49:05,320 MIKAYLA: It helped to know what my dad was feeling 1035 00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:07,489 and why she felt like she did. 1036 00:49:07,489 --> 00:49:09,491 It was nice to know 1037 00:49:09,491 --> 00:49:11,994 that it was more than just her. 1038 00:49:12,828 --> 00:49:15,455 Like there's more people out there who are like this. 1039 00:49:15,455 --> 00:49:17,457 JENN: Bring this foot forward just a touch. 1040 00:49:17,457 --> 00:49:18,709 There you go. 1041 00:49:21,837 --> 00:49:23,839 Good hit! Look at that! Right down the middle! 1042 00:49:24,923 --> 00:49:28,468 I am now Dad to my daughters again. 1043 00:49:28,468 --> 00:49:32,639 And even though I'm Jennifer, and I'm a female, 1044 00:49:32,639 --> 00:49:35,976 and I go by she/her pronouns, 1045 00:49:35,976 --> 00:49:39,104 that is a title that I will always own for my daughters 1046 00:49:39,104 --> 00:49:41,565 is Dad and Father. 1047 00:49:41,565 --> 00:49:44,193 [sizzling] 1048 00:49:44,193 --> 00:49:46,153 ♪ 1049 00:49:46,153 --> 00:49:48,447 TRICIA: If I can give any advice would be 1050 00:49:48,447 --> 00:49:50,949 to just keep moving forward, 1051 00:49:50,949 --> 00:49:53,660 making sure there's the honesty, 1052 00:49:53,660 --> 00:49:57,164 and not saying what people wanna hear, 1053 00:49:57,164 --> 00:50:00,250 but saying what is the truth. 1054 00:50:00,250 --> 00:50:03,462 [indistinct chatter] 1055 00:50:03,462 --> 00:50:07,132 Think it's really hard to accept someone 1056 00:50:07,132 --> 00:50:09,468 for who they are when you've known them 1057 00:50:09,468 --> 00:50:11,512 as someone else for so long. 1058 00:50:11,512 --> 00:50:14,806 But I also think you need to give an open mind 1059 00:50:14,806 --> 00:50:16,808 because our world is changing whether people like it or not. 1060 00:50:16,808 --> 00:50:19,353 [inaudible] 1061 00:50:24,942 --> 00:50:27,945 ♪