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Downloaded from
YTS.MX

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[Nathan] I'm Nathan Hill,
actor, writer, traveler.

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And I'm on a world tour
to uncover the sexual
culture and traditions

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Official YIFY movies site:
YTS.MX

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of people in exotic locations
all over the globe.

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Sex is part of our lives,
bodies and minds,

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our very existence
depends on it.

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It is treated and practiced
differently in every society.

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I'll encounter
the extraordinary,

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the festive, the tragic,
the unseen and the taboo.

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It's going to be
a fascinating ride.

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So join me as I lay bare
the universal instinct
that we all share

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in sex around the world.

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[upbeat music]

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I've just arrived in Melbourne,

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a burgeoning metropolis of
over four million people

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and the second largest
city in Australia.

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It's known for
its multicultural society,

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art precincts,
sporting communities,

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and exceptional coffee culture,
which I hope to sample.

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I'm told the people
here are laid-back

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in their attitude
towards life, work,

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and their attitude to sex.
In fact, the locals here refer
to this island continent

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as a lucky country because
of the great weather,

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beautiful beaches,
accessible health care,

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and their opportunities
for education.

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I'm here to explore how
the laid-back attitude

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extends towards sexual behavior,

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and how the abundance
of erotic stores,

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strip clubs, and prostitution
has affected this society.

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I'm going to talk
with sex workers,

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swingers, a brothel
madam, a male escort,

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bondage dominatrix,
and even local teenagers

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to unearth all of
Melbourne's sexual culture.

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And I'm going to start
here at the inner city
suburb of Richmond,

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the Passion Fruit
Sensuality Shop.

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It's part of a growing trend,
a new type of sex store

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that doesn't hide in a dark
alley behind black windows.

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In fact, it's right
smack bang in the middle of

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one of the city's most popular
fashion strips.

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And sure, it's about sex,

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but it doesn't run
from it and embraces it.

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[Nathan] The manager, Michelle
has agreed to show me around.

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So, the women that come
in are probably women

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that haven't been into
sex shops much before,

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and would refuse to
go into a sex shop.

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And women need to
feel comfortable,

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they need to, you know,
have a nice sort of,

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a nice shop to browse in
and have a look at,

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and maybe not something
that's just about sex,

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that's something that
really involves, you know,

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everything to do with sex,

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and that sort of, to me,
is more sensual, sort of.

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-So, less intimidating...
-Yeah.

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...as far as your sort of
classic sex shop goes.

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That's part of
the philosophy as well,

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where sex is more
than just the act,

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it's the anticipation,
it's the, you know,

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the mind, humor,
everything like that.

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And sensuality, soft things,

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and lingerie,
that kind of thing.

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And what have you
got out the back?

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And then we ask people
to come and have a look

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in our back room, so we part
the little curtain here.

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Part of the philosophy too,

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was that women should be
able to look and feel

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before they buy.
It's one of the most personal
products they'll ever buy.

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Can you tell us a little bit
in more detail how these work?

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So I notice you've got--
they call that the rabbit,
don't they?

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Yeah, these are called
the rabbit vibrators.

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For example, they have
a vibrating clitoral stimulator

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and a rotating internal shaft.

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So you can use
the shaft internally

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and that generally
rotates with beads inside

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for a little bit of
extra stimulation,

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and then you get a little, um,
clitoral vibrator here.

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So you're getting
internal penetration

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and clitoral external
stimulation at the same time.

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-[Nathan laughs]
-So, that's pretty
much everything.

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And this is probably, really
where the whole industry

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is going, towards more
luxury toys made

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by really good designers.

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These are all
rechargeable as well,

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so there's no need for
batteries anymore,

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you can just charge them up
like your phone.

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It's beautifully made,
you know, it looks gorgeous,

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that really makes a big
difference to women,

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-the look of it.
-Okay.

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And something like
this for example,

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which is just
a clitoral stimulator.

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It just looks so lovely,

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looks like a little massage
stone or something,

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just hold it in your palm

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and you can use it to, um...

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And men like these as well.

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-Right.
-Yeah, but just to use

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while you're having sex,
over the clitoris.

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Yeah, it's fantastic,
quite beautiful,

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-as well as effective.
-[both laughing]

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[Nathan] These toys were fun,

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but I really wanted to
find out from Michelle

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what she thought the
benefits of the passion

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for its store
were for Melbourne.

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Well, there's
the obvious physical,

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emotional, spiritual, benefits,

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but I just think, um,
a healthy sex life

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and growing up with a healthy
attitude towards sex

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just probably gives
you a bit more respect

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for yourself
and for your partner.

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And that's going to lead
to better decisions

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and a better person
that you'll be.

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And that sort of
leads to a better,

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more nourishing
society, I guess.

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[Nathan] Indeed, sex stores
have now entered

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the mainstream in Melbourne.

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The leading example of this
mainstreaming of sex shops

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is the blossoming 12 store
empire known as Sexyland.

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In fact, Sexyland describes
itself as a department store

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where one would
normally go in and buy

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furniture or kitchen goods,

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but I'm sure there's nothing
as boring as that in there.

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-Nice to meet you.
-Good to see you.

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-Thanks having us.
-Not a problem at all.

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-Can you give us a tour?
-Certainly, come through.

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Basically, what it's
based on, it's based on

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very open,
and friendly environment,
and fun environment.

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So, we're talking about,
um, first-timers,

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and starting out using
products in the store.

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You said that the oils
were a good starting point.

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That's right, oils and
body chocolates as well.

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So you can--
that's chocolate paste,

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-you can actually lick off.
-Yeah, either sauce,

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or this one,
which has a little brush,

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and you actually paint it on
and then eat it off.

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-Cool.
-[both laughing]

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Okay, so new products,

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we have the Tickler Treat,

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can you go into a bit of detail?

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Basically this is a range
of dongs and anal toys,

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um, they're made out,
um, of silicon.

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Basically what that means is
that the toy's non-porous

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and it's very safe
for your body.

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So just looking at the star
performer series here.

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-Yeah.
-Um.

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Women actually use these?

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Well, we don't actually
ask these things,

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what they do with them
once they buy them.

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Right, okay, so these
have intrigued me.

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You've got nearly
$600 for Bree Olsen's

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Cyber Skin Doggy-style
Vibrating Pussy and Ass.

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-That's right, that's right.
-Interesting,

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so, we're talking--
what are these made out of,
are they latex?

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Uh, no, they're actually
made out of cyber skin,

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-exactly what you said.
-Right.

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And it's a really, really,
uh, nice feeling material.

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It feels as close to
human skin as possible.

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-My goodness.
-And that one's actually
been molded off Bree Olson

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who's an adult star.

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As far as customer
demographics go,

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is it more men than women?

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Really with the age group,

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anything from young adults
right up to elderly.

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-Okay, really, wow!
-I had a couple who was

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-over 70, so I would say...
-Okay.

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...that's elderly, yeah,
and everything in between.

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Given that the
business is booming, um,

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in your opinion does,
does Melbourne have a

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more liberal or conservative
idea to the industry?

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Yeah, I think everyone
is really welcoming,

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um, even when
I say where I work,

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people are really happy to know,

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and they're really intrigued,
and they want to know.

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And most people are happy
to come into the store.

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-This is much more
like a supermarket.
-Correct.

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-It's white light...
-This is quite a bit different.

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-...everyone is open about it.
-That's right.

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Are customers like that? They
come and they're very open?

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Absolutely.
They're very open about it
and they're comfortable

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because it is exactly
what you explained,

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that it is bright and it's,

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um, well, it's not
dark and dingy,

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and it's not blacked-out
windows. I mean, we have

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latest lingerie
fashion in our windows.

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No newspapers blacking
out the windows, no.

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There's-- all these items
are basically creative,

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and they're here to help
people in their relation--

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Relationships are really
hard to maintain,
so any little bit helps.

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So, what do you think
the benefits are of
having a Sexyland

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where people can come in
and buy these products?

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What are long-term benefits

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of having an establishment
like this?

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The more happy people,

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probably the better
for the community.

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I'll likely sell mostly things
that would make people happy,

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whether they're on their own
or whether they're as a couple.

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I think, probably the more happy
people the better. [chuckles]

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So, if sex really is all around,
becoming more prevalent,

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how do Melburnians
feel about it?

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What is the social impact?

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I'm here to meet
with local writer

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and sex expert, Claire Halliday.

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Hopefully she can shed
some light on the subject.

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I think we're kind of secretly,
sexually conservative,

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and we're sort of forced
to live in a society that, um,

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wants us to believe that
we're sexually liberal.

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So we do have this
plethora of, you know,

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sex stores, and brothels,
and things like that,

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but, you know,
try asking somebody

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if they've been to
one, or, you know,

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and get an honest answer.

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They might be there,
but nobody wants to admit

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that they, you know,
utilize the services.

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So in that way, we're
sexually conservative, I guess,

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obviously people are using them.

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They wouldn't be on every corner

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-if they weren't making profits.
-Sure.

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But I think, you know, nobody's
really going to own up to,

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you know, visiting a brothel.

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Are you shocked at
the, uh, information

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that's so available
to your own kids?

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I'm not particularly shocked
by anything anymore,

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because I've spent
a lot of years

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researching different
aspects of the sex industry,

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and I've seen and heard
all kinds of things

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that make me kind of
unshockable at the moment.

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But in terms of my own children,

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I think there is a lot
of information out there

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that, um, I'm disappointed in,
that, you know,

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like I said, the
articles in "Girlfriend,"

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teaching you how to
have safe anal sex.

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I don't want my daughter
to read that when she's 13.

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So, they're making
it more acceptable

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or look like it
should be the norm.

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Yeah, and obviously
that's been sold to them,

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you know, on a societal,
on a broader societal level,

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I guess, from,
you know, the stream

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of sexualized material that
is just in your face,

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especially in
the last ten years.

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We're giving kids today
so much sexualized material,

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yet sex education in
schools is lacking,

241
00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,480
so we're throwing all this
sexualized material at them,

242
00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:26,840
we're not giving
them the context

243
00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:28,840
to properly understand it.

244
00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:31,040
and while we're teaching them
the nuts and bolts
of the mechanics

245
00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:33,680
of what goes where, I don't
think we're teaching them

246
00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:37,960
the emotional, um,
aspects and, you know,

247
00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:42,200
how to make good choices, and
respect, and things like that.

248
00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:44,440
So, Claire, just
on a final note,

249
00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:46,240
what do you hope your book,

250
00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,400
"Do You Want Sex With
That?" um, will achieve?

251
00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:51,520
So I'm hoping that
anybody reading the book,

252
00:09:51,560 --> 00:09:53,200
it might just make
them think more,

253
00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:55,480
it might just make them
look at what's going on,

254
00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:58,000
you know, around us
as a society,

255
00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:00,200
and question whether they
think it's gone too far.

256
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,920
And if they do think that then,
you know, what do we do next?

257
00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:05,440
I just want people
to look more closely

258
00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:06,960
at what we're being fed,

259
00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:09,240
and maybe question if
it's the right thing,

260
00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:10,920
and what we can do about it.

261
00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,560
[Nathan] Claire painted
a picture of Melbourne

262
00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:15,560
as very confused about
its sexual identity.

263
00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:18,040
But in a city that considers
itself sophisticated,

264
00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:20,560
cosmopolitan, and intellectual,
is it compatible?

265
00:10:20,600 --> 00:10:23,000
But here on King Street
in the middle of the CBD,

266
00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:24,280
there are mega
strip clubs that cater

267
00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:26,240
to thousands of men every night,

268
00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:30,480
with names like Showgirls
Bar 20, Club X, Crazyhorse,

269
00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:32,960
even the international
franchise, Spearmint Rhino.

270
00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,960
I'm told it's built on a long
entrenched party culture

271
00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:39,160
of after works drinks
and pre-wedding bucks nights.

272
00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:41,880
[Nathan] Stripper, or exotic
dancer if you prefer, Honey,

273
00:10:41,920 --> 00:10:43,360
has agreed to talk with me.

274
00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:45,520
[Nathan] Why did you
choose this as a job

275
00:10:45,560 --> 00:10:47,760
compared to, you know,
other jobs?

276
00:10:47,800 --> 00:10:50,000
Well, sort of the pay,

277
00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:53,000
because I'm living on my own
with my younger brother,

278
00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:54,960
and I have to raise
him and everything.

279
00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,920
so, I just thought I'd start

280
00:10:57,960 --> 00:10:59,680
doing this stripper job,
it's good money.

281
00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:01,040
How did you feel when you did

282
00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:02,880
your first dance live on stage?

283
00:11:02,920 --> 00:11:05,480
Well, I felt a lot
of butterflies,

284
00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,120
and I'm like, "Oh, my God,
what am I doing up here?

285
00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:12,400
How am I going to do this?"
Like, you know, you've got
so many people watching you.

286
00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:14,720
But I just said, "Okay,
I got to be confident,"

287
00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:16,840
and one of the other strippers
that was teaching me said,

288
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:20,360
"Just be confident, do the job,
and you'll get through it."
So, yeah.

289
00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:22,640
Do you make a lot of money
in this profession?

290
00:11:22,680 --> 00:11:24,480
Like, at the end of the week,
do you go, "Hmm"?

291
00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:26,480
Are you satisfied with the cash,
with cash pot?

292
00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:29,160
Yeah, yeah, I am satisfied
with the cash that I'm getting,

293
00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:31,480
um, but it does go,
it's not like--

294
00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,840
everyone's like, "Oh, you're
a stripper, you're rich."

295
00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:36,200
And it's like,
"But it does go on things,"

296
00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,040
do you know what I mean? Like,
you've got to buy your make ups,

297
00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:42,480
and you got to cut
off the products
that you need for yourself.

298
00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:44,800
Do your family and friends,
and I bet this,
I mean, obviously,

299
00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:47,440
-your younger brother,
he knows what you do?
-Yeah, my younger brother does.

300
00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:49,880
Do your friends know,
or do you have friends
that have got no idea?

301
00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:51,640
[Honey] I've got a few friends
that know and a few

302
00:11:51,680 --> 00:11:53,800
friends that have no idea
and I won't tell them.

303
00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,000
I know which ones
will stick by me,

304
00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:57,960
and which ones understand,
and which ones don't.

305
00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,200
So the ones that do
understand that, I'll tell.

306
00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:02,760
So there is a stigma
then, because there's some
people you won't tell

307
00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:04,000
because you're scared
of their reaction?

308
00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:05,280
-[Honey] Exactly, yeah.
-Okay.

309
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:06,960
And my parents don't
know either, so.

310
00:12:07,000 --> 00:12:08,040
-They don't?
-No.

311
00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:09,320
How do you find the customers,

312
00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:11,160
the males,
how do they treat you?

313
00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,840
Um, you get a lot of-- I've had
a lot of respect for, like,

314
00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:17,080
guys that haven't tried
to do anything to me,
or anything, or disrespect me,

315
00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:19,160
but you get, sometimes
you get sleazes in there

316
00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:20,880
trying to take photos of you.

317
00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:22,520
-Oh, yeah?
-So that's the part

318
00:12:22,560 --> 00:12:24,360
-where it's--
-On their mobile phones,

319
00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:26,080
and trying to shoot
a video or something?

320
00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:28,880
-Yeah.
-Do the customers
proposition you for sex

321
00:12:28,920 --> 00:12:31,120
after a show
or during the night?

322
00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:33,120
Do you get guys
coming on to you?

323
00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:34,720
Yeah, yeah, I've had
a few guys that ask,

324
00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:36,160
"Do you want to
come hang with me?

325
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:37,520
A thousand dollars,
two thousand," like,

326
00:12:37,560 --> 00:12:38,960
you know, your money's
not worth it,

327
00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:40,800
it's only the dance,
do you know what I mean?

328
00:12:40,840 --> 00:12:44,040
It's like, that's as far
as I'll go, a dance, so.

329
00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:45,400
So you don't cross
the line there?

330
00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:46,800
No, [chuckles] no way.

331
00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:49,240
What about your long-term
career prospects?

332
00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:51,000
Like, do you want to stay
here until finish uni?

333
00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:52,480
Is this the sort of job
you'll keep going?

334
00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:54,040
Yes, I want to keep going,

335
00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,720
so I want to keep,
like, doing this,

336
00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,120
but I want to pay,
like, help it pay off

337
00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:00,920
my studies and everything.

338
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:02,960
[Nathan] Honey is a dancer
at Maxine's,

339
00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:04,440
an establishment that belongs to

340
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:06,160
the queen of Melbourne's
adult industry

341
00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:09,360
and a high-profile social
identity, Maxine Fensom.

342
00:13:10,440 --> 00:13:14,160
In a business dominated by men, Maxine bucks the trend.

343
00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,280
Not only is she
the city's biggest provider

344
00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:18,480
of private strip
services and dancers,

345
00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:22,240
she also runs five erotic
websites, an escort service,

346
00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:24,560
started the Australian
adult industry awards,

347
00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,120
and even campaigned
for Parliament.

348
00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:28,760
But perhaps she'd like me
to introduce her

349
00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,480
in the words she uses
to describe herself,

350
00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,520
the Queen of pussy.

351
00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:35,000
[Nathan] Maxine you have
a fascinating story,

352
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:36,720
please share with us
some of your journey.

353
00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:38,840
Well, basically, I fell
into this business,

354
00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:40,440
and if anyone said that
I was going to work

355
00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:42,000
in this sort of industry
I would have said,

356
00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,760
"No, I don't think so."
So, I saw an ad in the--

357
00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:47,120
one of the papers and they
wanted a topless waitress,

358
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,520
and I, "Umm'd" and, "Ah'd"
for about three weeks.

359
00:13:49,560 --> 00:13:52,840
I eventually plucked up
the courage and went
for an interview.

360
00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:55,640
I had to show this
dirty old man my boobs,

361
00:13:55,680 --> 00:13:58,640
and of course I got the job,
stayed there a week.

362
00:13:58,680 --> 00:14:01,320
And he was doing like,
these like, these lunches,

363
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:05,240
and I thought, "God, I could do
that." And I could do it,
you know, kind of nicer.

364
00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:07,920
And I knew lots of men,
so that's how Maxine started.

365
00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:10,200
Then I started, like,
a stripping agency.

366
00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:12,080
And then prostitution
became legal,

367
00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:13,960
so then I applied for a license.

368
00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,040
I was one of the first people
to get an escort agency license,

369
00:14:17,080 --> 00:14:18,880
so then I did that,

370
00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,040
and then I started doing
lots of events as well,

371
00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:26,480
like Dildorama, Miss Nude,
Miss Dream Girl, Miss Erotica.

372
00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:28,520
I founded the Adult
Industry Awards

373
00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:30,120
which is 11 years strong.

374
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:31,560
I've been here for
three and a half years,

375
00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:33,400
great girls,
good staff, good management,

376
00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:35,120
all female management too,
I might add.

377
00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:38,000
And to be honest,
that's why I like it, um.

378
00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:39,920
But it's, it's
a family atmosphere,

379
00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:42,400
it's a very friendly
environment here.

380
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:44,960
What state is the adult industry

381
00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:46,480
in, in Melbourne, do you think?

382
00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:48,560
Well, I think we're all
sort of struggling

383
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:49,920
just to keep our
head above water,

384
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:51,120
just on a political level.

385
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:52,280
The police are fairly,

386
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:53,600
have been fairly heavy-handed

387
00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,440
with the adult industry.

388
00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:57,520
And I think that's
the struggle for all of us

389
00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,000
on a day-to-day basis,

390
00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:01,600
and just the red tape
and the bureaucracy

391
00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:04,040
of running at this sort
of legal business.

392
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:07,400
People have no understanding,
particularly politicians about

393
00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,920
how this business is,
they're afraid,

394
00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,120
they don't want to know about
it, so they kind of penalize us.

395
00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,600
You know,
it's hard when, you know,
we're open-minded people

396
00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,600
and we just want to run our
business, and then you've got
people who don't understand

397
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:21,200
our business,
and all they want to do

398
00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:23,200
is, um, basically close it down.

399
00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:25,040
So as far as the adult
industry is concerned,

400
00:15:25,080 --> 00:15:26,200
do you believe it has a positive

401
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:27,760
or negative effect on society?

402
00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:30,840
I think, um,
myself it's positive.

403
00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:32,080
Well, you know, it's employment,

404
00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:34,440
it's a legally run business,

405
00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:37,360
uh, it's run by a woman
as far as my business.

406
00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:39,240
And I think, you know,
girls can come in here

407
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:41,400
and make a lot of money as
long as they're focused,

408
00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,080
and, you know,
give yourself five years,

409
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:44,720
and make some money
and buy, you know,

410
00:15:44,760 --> 00:15:47,800
a portfolio of houses
and set yourself up.

411
00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:50,000
[upbeat music]

412
00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:02,680
You only have to spend
a night in Melbourne

413
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:05,080
to realize it as
an energetic party scene.

414
00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:07,360
You see, alcohol is
available from age 18.

415
00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:09,760
And every weekend, teenagers
and 20-somethings

416
00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:12,760
pour into the city to drink
and dance the night away.

417
00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:14,760
Some of them even
end up at recovery parties,

418
00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:17,680
which might seem like
a contradiction,
but I'm assured it's not.

419
00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,640
But you see Melbourne is
also a maze of lane-ways,

420
00:16:20,680 --> 00:16:22,440
and alleys,
and sometimes it's hard

421
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:24,160
to find the right club to go to

422
00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:25,960
unless you're in the know.

423
00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:28,240
But luckily tonight for us,
we're in the know

424
00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:30,880
and we're heading off
to trendy Baroque House.

425
00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:33,920
[club music]

426
00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:48,840
What's a normal Saturday
night like here

427
00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,800
as far as, um, meeting someone's
concerned, or picking up?

428
00:16:52,840 --> 00:16:54,400
-Picking up?
-[laughing]

429
00:16:54,440 --> 00:16:56,840
I don't know, there's a lot
to choose from here.

430
00:16:56,880 --> 00:16:58,560
There's a lot more girls
though, isn't it, than guys?

431
00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:00,200
-At the moment, yes, yeah.
-Yeah.

432
00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:02,360
Which is probably
a good thing, you know.

433
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:05,120
So, what time does
this place go till?

434
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:07,880
I don't know, maybe,
like four, four-thirty.

435
00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:09,160
And you're here every Saturday?

436
00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:10,320
-Yeah.
-Yeah.

437
00:17:10,360 --> 00:17:11,640
Yeah, awesome!

438
00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:13,360
How do you find
the sexual culture

439
00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:14,920
in Melbourne as a whole?

440
00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:17,720
I would-- Melbourne's
very liberated.

441
00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,120
And is picking up the main
thing here at Baroque House?

442
00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:24,720
Uh, you would think so,
if you look around tonight,

443
00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:26,480
there's plenty of women
here for the men.

444
00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,520
And, uh, I think 90% of people,
what they come out for

445
00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:31,280
is to pick up ladies,

446
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:32,800
and they got ladies
to pick up the guys, so.

447
00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:34,440
To have more sex
and have more fun,

448
00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,000
that's what I would say,
that's all! [laughs]

449
00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:40,400
[club music]

450
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:53,200
-How you going?
-Hi!

451
00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:54,760
-What's your name?
-Paula.

452
00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:56,080
-Paula?
-Yeah.

453
00:17:56,120 --> 00:17:57,320
-How are you?
-Good, how are you?

454
00:17:57,360 --> 00:17:58,440
-I'm great.
-What's your name?

455
00:17:58,480 --> 00:17:59,560
My name's Nathan.

456
00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:00,880
Can you tell me what you think

457
00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:02,400
about sexual culture
in Melbourne?

458
00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:07,320
I think these days people
are sluts, like real bad.

459
00:18:07,360 --> 00:18:09,920
Like, you buy a girl two
drinks and she's like,

460
00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,200
"Yeah, I'll bang you,"
but, like,

461
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,280
it's fucking wrong, yeah? Yeah.

462
00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:17,040
That's interesting. How many
guys do you have hit on you

463
00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:18,640
when you go out on
any particular night,

464
00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:20,440
-like, on a Saturday night?
-Countless.

465
00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:21,640
-Yeah?
-Yeah.

466
00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:24,200
Do you think that
alcohol and drugs

467
00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,400
plays a big part in sexual
culture in Melbourne?

468
00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:30,600
'Cause once
you're high, free love!

469
00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:31,880
Yeah! [laughs]

470
00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:33,880
Thank you so much for your time.

471
00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:36,160
Thank you, nice to meet you.

472
00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:38,040
What do you think about
same-sex picking up?

473
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,000
Like, do you know, like,
do many of your girlfriends

474
00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:41,320
or yourself ever pick up girls?

475
00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:43,960
I think when girls
go out together

476
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,680
they're more
affectionate than guys,

477
00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:47,200
so they kind of fool
around and that,

478
00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:48,520
and it's just for kicks,

479
00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:50,560
like, they don't, you know,

480
00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:52,640
it doesn't usually
mean anything.

481
00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:55,680
But then again it is awkward
when you kiss a girl

482
00:18:55,720 --> 00:18:58,760
and they are a lesbian,
that's a little bit awkward.

483
00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:00,560
-The kind of people--
-[Nathan] I also had a chance

484
00:19:00,600 --> 00:19:03,640
to talk to Darren, who is organizing tonight's club event,

485
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,000
and ask him about the sexual
culture in Melbourne.

486
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:10,000
...you know,
that's the environment
that we're running here.

487
00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:12,320
It's making sure that everyone
can meet who they want to meet,

488
00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:14,360
and make sure they can
have fun while they do it,

489
00:19:14,400 --> 00:19:16,320
but certainly there's a lot
of that sexual activity

490
00:19:16,360 --> 00:19:19,000
in Melbourne, it's just whether
you know about it or not.

491
00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:21,560
People are out there every week
and they're meeting new people.

492
00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:23,760
I think people are a lot more
active than they let off.

493
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,280
Do you think alcohol
and/or drugs

494
00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:29,000
is a big influence
towards a sexual culture,

495
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:31,680
and sexual exploration
that goes down in the city?

496
00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:33,400
Yeah, well,
another great question.

497
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:36,920
You see, there's a lot of
guys who are into the drugs

498
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:39,080
and a lot of girls
follow that about them,

499
00:19:39,120 --> 00:19:42,880
so, you know, it's sometimes sad
to see what some people would do

500
00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:44,200
to be part of that experience,

501
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:45,960
but I'm think it
does by a huge part,

502
00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:47,560
probably more than we think,

503
00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:50,280
but, um, certainly, you know
behind closed doors,

504
00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:51,520
anyone can do what they like.

505
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,360
[club music]

506
00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:09,040
[Nathan] The idea of teenagers
bumping into each other

507
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:10,240
on the dance floor
is a little too tame

508
00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,000
for some people's tastes.

509
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:13,560
You see, there's
a thriving underground

510
00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,080
swingers culture
here in Melbourne

511
00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:17,240
that dates back to the 1960s.

512
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:18,640
So, we're going to head
out into the suburbs

513
00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:20,480
to talk to the host
of Club True Blue,

514
00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:23,560
one of Melbourne's
longest-running swingers clubs.

515
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:25,320
-Welcome, Nathan.
-Thanks, guys.

516
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:28,120
This is where we hold our
parties, Club True Blue.

517
00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:30,680
Can you tell us about the club
itself and how it began?

518
00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:35,160
Well, we started the, uh,
parties back in, well, 2000 now,

519
00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:36,760
so it's ten years or so.

520
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:38,440
So you obviously
enjoy it because--

521
00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,080
-the length it's been going.
-[laughing]

522
00:20:40,120 --> 00:20:41,960
It looks like it actually
has to be couples?

523
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:45,240
-Yeah, it's only couples
that we... we run for, yeah.
-Okay.

524
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,040
-Just for swinging couples.
-I suppose the history
of swinging is couples.

525
00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:49,520
-It is couples.
-Yeah, yeah.

526
00:20:49,560 --> 00:20:51,200
I mean, we occasionally
as in singles,

527
00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:53,120
single ladies
but not single men.

528
00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:55,360
You seem to attract
all sorts of people

529
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:58,200
from all different
walks of life and, uh...

530
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,000
Yeah, there's nothing
really specific

531
00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:01,840
that you'd say that there's
a certain type of person.

532
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:03,880
But you guys are
obviously comfortable,

533
00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:05,920
but perhaps more comfortable
even physically

534
00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:07,360
than a lot of other people.

535
00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:11,000
After speaking for
a female perspective, um,

536
00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:13,680
you know, a lot of women,
they have body issues,
and all the rest of it.

537
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,760
The parties have really
helped me overcome that,

538
00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:18,840
because everyone, sort of,
when they dress down,

539
00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:20,440
they're walking around
in lingerie or nothing.

540
00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:24,160
And no one cares
what you look like, um.

541
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:26,480
-So there's not
pretentiousness--
-No, not at all.

542
00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:28,280
It's a comfortable environment,
and everybody here

543
00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:30,280
-are thinking the same way.
-Exactly.

544
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:33,040
I suppose, the best way,
for when I describe
it to first timers,

545
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,400
is like going to a friend's
place for a party.

546
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:37,360
All very friendly,
very relaxed, very casual,

547
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:39,000
just obviously with
the added extra.

548
00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:40,440
-Yeah.
-Yeah, yeah.

549
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:41,680
[Nathan] I really wanted
to find out

550
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:43,240
why couples engage in swinging,

551
00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:45,000
and to answer this,
David and Julie

552
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:47,480
took me to their bedroom.

553
00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:49,040
Because I think it's
a natural part of life,

554
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,040
as in, we all enjoy the sex,

555
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:53,560
and, um, for the fact
that you can

556
00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:55,120
experience it with your partner,

557
00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:56,880
we all have different
fantasies and so forth.

558
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:00,640
One partner might not be
able to, um, provide all that,

559
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:02,520
where-- and then you get
people that are cheating,

560
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,360
and have affairs,
and go behind our backs,

561
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:05,880
and have all these
secrets and things

562
00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:07,800
to try and live that life,
whereas you don't,

563
00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,360
you don't need to in
this sort of lifestyle.

564
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:12,000
You can enjoy
everything you want.

565
00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:13,400
It's all very open and honest.

566
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:15,760
So, if you could run us
through a normal,

567
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:17,040
normal night here
for the events,

568
00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:18,760
how they unfold from
start to finish.

569
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:21,360
What would we expect if we
came down on our first time?

570
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:24,760
When people first arrive,
either David or myself
will show people into the house.

571
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:28,440
We'll show them around, um,
introduce them to all the
other people that are here,

572
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,120
and then usually for
about the first hour,

573
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:31,960
hour and a half, very social.

574
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:33,680
People have a few
drinks, mix and mingle.

575
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,640
We've got a spa set up
out in our garage.

576
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:39,840
Um, then after that time
people will dress down,

577
00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:41,040
whatever they're
comfortable wearing,

578
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,040
lingerie, erotic gear,

579
00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:45,480
and head off into
the rooms for a bit of fun.

580
00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:47,840
Then about-- and after
an hour or so,

581
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:49,960
people will come up for
some fresh air... [chuckles]

582
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:52,160
...have a few drinks,
sort of freshen themselves up,

583
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:53,960
and then the evenings
usually finish up

584
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:56,240
one thirty-ish, thereabouts.

585
00:22:56,280 --> 00:22:58,160
How is it that you
are strong enough

586
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,440
and are able to overcome
the, uh, feeling of jealousy?

587
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:05,520
For one, we have a very open
and straightforward
relationship.

588
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:08,520
There's no, no need
to have any, any doubts,

589
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:10,680
or secrets,
or anything like that.

590
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,960
So, for me, I can talk
to Julie about anything,

591
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:16,040
and I think for most people
that are in the lifestyle,

592
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:17,920
I think it seems
to be the same way.

593
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:20,320
They have a very open
and strong relationship,

594
00:23:20,360 --> 00:23:22,400
so the jealousies may be there,

595
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:25,640
but they don't really, um,
you know, create any issues.

596
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:27,400
I find that, you know,
they're the sort of things

597
00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:30,560
that create problems
for, uh, couples,

598
00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:32,120
is when you've got those
sort of restrictions,

599
00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:33,560
and one doesn't match the other,

600
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:35,320
and you're not living
a happy lifestyle,

601
00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:37,480
everything's going
to get in the way

602
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:39,680
and create problems, you know.
I think this way you can live

603
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:42,080
an open and honest relationship

604
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:44,280
that, um, you're both very close

605
00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,720
-and comfortable
with each other.
-I suppose you're not ever then

606
00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,080
worried that someone's
going to cheat eventually.

607
00:23:50,120 --> 00:23:52,280
-No, not really.
-It's not there.

608
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:54,360
It's actually, uh,
more encouraged

609
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:57,760
to, uh, have those desires
and, um, fantasies,

610
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:02,040
and experiment with them,
more so than try and keep
it from your partner.

611
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,240
It's really about
encouraging to be involved.

612
00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:06,200
I think our whole culture
and our lifestyles

613
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:09,520
are starting to open up,
and become more aware,

614
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,960
and, uh, focused on what
we want and so forth.

615
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,280
And that really, I suppose,

616
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,080
attracts people to this
sort of lifestyle.

617
00:24:16,120 --> 00:24:17,880
[Julie] Yeah, and we don't
go door knocking.

618
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,680
[laughs] No, we don't.

619
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:22,480
-They'll come and knock here.
-Maybe we should?

620
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:24,320
-Well.
-[both laughing]

621
00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:26,360
Thank you so much for your
time guys, it's been great.

622
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:27,720
-You're welcome,
-Pleasure, thank you.

623
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:29,160
-Lovely to talk.
-Thank you so much.

624
00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:30,480
My experience has taught me

625
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:31,960
that most people find the idea

626
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,320
of swapping their partner
for sex unappealing.

627
00:24:34,360 --> 00:24:35,760
I'm here to speak
with Dr. Janet Horn,

628
00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:37,480
or Dr. Jan as
she likes to be called,

629
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,200
who's a clinical psychologist,
relationship expert,

630
00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:42,280
and has written dozens
of books on sex.

631
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:43,720
I'm hoping she can
help me understand

632
00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:45,600
the idea behind
swingers parties,

633
00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,240
and the health behind
Melbourne's diverse sexual
culture.

634
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:50,800
[Nathan] What do you believe
is the modern

635
00:24:50,840 --> 00:24:52,400
sexual attitude in Melbourne?

636
00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,200
Well, I think that sex
nowadays is anything goes,

637
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,560
and whereas in other, um, eras

638
00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,440
might have said the same
in the, you know, 1920s, uh,

639
00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:04,880
nowadays women are not repressed

640
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:06,360
in the ways that they were.

641
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:08,520
And in fact they now say that

642
00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:12,240
oral all sex is
the new goodnight kiss.

643
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,480
So, I'm fascinated with how
young people in particular

644
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,280
hook up and have
sex with strangers.

645
00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:21,720
Do you think that men
become addicted to sex, uh,

646
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:23,720
because it's a good--
it's used as a stress relief?

647
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,640
I think a lot of men
use sex as a de-stress,

648
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,000
and they will go to something
like a prostitute,

649
00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:33,080
or online, or a
swinging situation

650
00:25:33,120 --> 00:25:36,480
because, um, they've
got no obligation

651
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:38,760
to express themselves
emotionally,

652
00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:40,280
but they get that release

653
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:42,520
because of the sexual
gratification.

654
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:44,880
And there's release, relief,

655
00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:46,720
um, and then there's
sort of some space

656
00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:48,400
emotionally for them.

657
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:50,400
And, um, then they're on
the rollercoaster

658
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:52,160
because next time they
feel the pressure,

659
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:54,840
the stress, it's like, "Aw,
what made me feel good last time

660
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:57,480
was sexual expression,
let's go get it again."

661
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,080
The next minute,
they're addicted.

662
00:25:59,120 --> 00:26:00,480
This is different for
women though, isn't it?

663
00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:03,000
Because women, uh, can we say,

664
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:05,000
feel pleasure in perhaps
a slightly different way?

665
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,160
I think that, um,
there really isn't, um,

666
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:11,160
the same
opportunities for women.
Sure, there's online sex,

667
00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:14,160
but most women would be quite
satisfied with their vibrator.

668
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:16,840
-[chuckles]
-And, um, you know,
even older women now

669
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:19,560
have discovered how easy it is

670
00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:22,440
to use a vibrator to
have an orgasm, so.

671
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:26,240
You know, it's like for
them, um, in the moment

672
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:28,560
they have their own
way of getting off,

673
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,080
and, um, they're happy
enough with that.

674
00:26:31,120 --> 00:26:33,280
They don't need
the complications.

675
00:26:33,320 --> 00:26:35,600
Is Melbourne considered
sexually healthy, um,

676
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:37,200
in relation to other countries?

677
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,200
Well, you know, we have the
stereotypes around countries,

678
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:43,440
you know, like in
Holland, and Amsterdam,

679
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:44,560
and the red-light district

680
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:46,080
just being really, really, open.

681
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:49,320
And Melbourne doesn't
really have the same,

682
00:26:49,360 --> 00:26:52,280
the King's Cross that they
might have in Sydney,

683
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,680
but I think that particularly
for young people,

684
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:58,760
um, that hook up, um, ability,
it's happening worldwide.

685
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,160
Obviously with that though
also comes more problems,

686
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:03,360
more STIs, more STDs.

687
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:06,000
Well, yes, safe sex
really is, you know,

688
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,520
the be-all,
end-all, or should be.

689
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:10,600
But, uh,
there are so many people

690
00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:12,800
who also do the bare-backing

691
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,240
that could put
them in, you know,

692
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,680
severe, at severe health risks.

693
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:21,280
Um, I think that, just,
it's often fueled by
alcohol or drugs.

694
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:24,800
I was just about to say that.
Do you think that
in Melbourne that, um,

695
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,560
you know, sexual freedom
or experimentation

696
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:29,880
is fueled by intoxication?

697
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,920
Well, I think in Melbourne
and every other
place of the world

698
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:38,640
that, you know, once it--
there's some kind of, um,
substance being enjoyed,

699
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:40,560
um, then inhibitions go down

700
00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,240
and, um, sexual expression
becomes easy.

701
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:46,360
That seems to be the culture
here, is that people will go out

702
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,360
on the weekend
after they've worked all week,

703
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:50,360
they'll drink until
their tipsy or drunk,

704
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,280
and then they'll
have the booty calls,

705
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:53,480
or they'll try and pick up.

706
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:54,840
And the one-night stands

707
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:56,640
-are quite, uh, popular.
-Absolutely.

708
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:59,160
I mean, I had a young
girl, she was only 23

709
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:00,760
and gorgeous, like
a little fairy.

710
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:02,840
She was just really,
really pretty,

711
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:05,480
great figure. And she said,
"I've never had an orgasm."

712
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:07,360
And I said, "Oh
well, tell me about,

713
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:08,560
you know, your partners."

714
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,440
And she said, "I've lost count."

715
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,840
I said, "What happened?"
She said, "I go out
on Friday night,

716
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:14,960
get drunk, and then end up

717
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,640
having sex with somebody."
And I said, "Why?"

718
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,560
-And she said,
"Well, you just do it."
-[Nathan lightly chuckles]

719
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:22,560
[upbeat music]

720
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:27,400
American comedian
Billy Crystal once said,

721
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:28,800
"Women need a reason
to have sex,

722
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:30,400
men just need a place."

723
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:32,200
Well, if you live in
Melbourne you're in luck.

724
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:35,280
The city has had legal
prostitution since 1986,

725
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,000
and illegal massage parlors

726
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,080
existed for over
a century before that.

727
00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,800
There are currently about
a hundred registered
brothels in town,

728
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:43,600
and today I'm at
the biggest one of them all.

729
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,640
The world-renowned Daily Planet.

730
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:47,160
It's so successful
it's even listed

731
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:48,880
on the Australian
Stock Exchange.

732
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:55,480
The Daily Planet is, um,
Melbourne's, um, oldest

733
00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,480
and certainly among
the largest registered,

734
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:02,160
licensed brothel in
the southern hemisphere.

735
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,640
Um, we are registered
here for 18 rooms

736
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:07,920
to be able to use
for prostitution.

737
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:09,840
Okay, wow, can you
give us a tour?

738
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,440
We certainly can, off we go.

739
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,760
-Each room has, um, a name.
-Right.

740
00:29:15,800 --> 00:29:18,600
And we're just now going
to see the Mediterranean.

741
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:19,760
The Mediterranean.

742
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:30,920
-Oh, wow, okay.
-This is the largest room
that we have, um, in the brothel

743
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,840
with the three, um,
the three beds,

744
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:35,840
and it has the largest spa.

745
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:38,640
-Um, we call this a party room.
-Okay. [chuckles]

746
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:42,960
It is available to just, um,
a couple if they want,

747
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:47,200
but if there are, um,
gentlemen wanting

748
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,200
to have, you know, two ladies,

749
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,280
or two gentlemen here
with two ladies,

750
00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:53,480
we usually allocate
them to this room.

751
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:56,520
[Nathan] And what about
the hygiene issues?

752
00:29:56,560 --> 00:30:00,480
Well, we run under very
strict, um, regulations here.

753
00:30:00,520 --> 00:30:04,520
All of the towels, beds,
sheets, et cetera, um,

754
00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:08,560
of course are constantly
changed and washed.

755
00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:10,200
And as far as infections go
and stuff like that,

756
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,440
are the women tested regularly?

757
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:14,960
By law they're
required to be tested.

758
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,480
They have, um, swabs done
and have to give us

759
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:19,440
a medical certificate
every month.

760
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:21,240
-Right.
-And they also have to have

761
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,000
blood for HIV, et cetera,

762
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:26,840
and at the moment that's
on a three monthly basis.

763
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:28,760
[Nathan] The Daily Planet
also has a strict

764
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:32,080
no sexual contact
without a condom rule,

765
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:36,560
to ensure the health of both
its workers and its customers.

766
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,200
The girls each have
favorite rooms,

767
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:41,360
you know, that they're--
they like to use.

768
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,600
Some of them like to
use the smaller ones,

769
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:46,840
some of them are happier in,
um, the slightly larger ones.

770
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,200
Okay, nice shower
though, nice beds,

771
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,000
-and obviously a beautiful spa.
-A beautiful spa.

772
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,840
[Nathan] Gayle seemed a most
unlikely brothel madam

773
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:58,280
and she had an endearing
sense of humor about the job.

774
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:01,480
-Mirrors on the roof.
-Mirrors on the ceiling,

775
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,440
they're not necessarily
always a good look.

776
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,320
As you look up
you probably think,

777
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,640
"Good God, I didn't realize
I looked that bad."

778
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:13,280
-[both laughing]
-Oh, wow.

779
00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:15,040
[Nathan] But I really wanted
to find out more

780
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,200
about the girls that worked
at The Daily Planet.

781
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:20,520
Gayle, how many women are
working here at any one time?

782
00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:22,800
During the daytime we only, um,

783
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:25,000
we perhaps average six to eight

784
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,520
between ten o'clock in the
morning till 8 o'clock at night.

785
00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,880
Um, of an evening we certainly
have more come on duty.

786
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:33,880
On Friday and Saturday nights

787
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,040
we have 30-plus ladies
on duty at any one time.

788
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:38,920
And how long would
any girl be working?

789
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,160
They can choose to do as
many shifts as they like,

790
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,160
but we watch that.

791
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,120
If someone is doing
a lot of shifts

792
00:31:47,160 --> 00:31:49,040
and doing a lot of bookings,

793
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,480
um, whereas that's great for
us that they're here,

794
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:55,560
it sometimes is not necessarily
the best thing for the girl.

795
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,400
-And how old? What age range
are we looking at?
-Um...

796
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,320
Well, they range from 18,

797
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:03,800
because it's certainly illegal

798
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:05,560
to be here under that age.

799
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:08,440
And I think the lady,
the oldest lady

800
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:12,960
that, um, we have that comes
in, is in her early 50s.

801
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:14,160
Hmm, okay, wow.

802
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,800
[Gayle] I personally think that,

803
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,480
um, it's a very difficult
job that they do,

804
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,040
um, and I've spoken to some
of them about it,

805
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:28,120
how do they actually
manage to, um, be normal?

806
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,000
-Um--
-how do they function outside?

807
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:32,920
Function outside-- um, when you
do the job that they do.

808
00:32:32,960 --> 00:32:35,360
And they have different
ways of approaching it.

809
00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:39,600
Um, all the ladies that I
certainly know that work here,

810
00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:44,480
um, they're very upbeat.
Um, they're happy

811
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:46,800
with what they're doing because
they've chosen to do it.

812
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,760
-Okay, right.
-It's their choice, um,

813
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:52,680
how they, um,
conduct their lives, um--

814
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,880
Right, so you wouldn't have
a girl that works here

815
00:32:54,920 --> 00:32:57,320
who comes in, who hates it,
that doesn't want to be here?

816
00:32:57,360 --> 00:32:59,240
-I don't believe so, no.
-Okay.

817
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:03,120
Some of them they said, like,
they really like sex.

818
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:05,720
It doesn't serve the purposes.
If she really hates it,

819
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:09,480
it would reflect in the service
that you gave to the client.

820
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:13,080
You can hardly be really
hating what you're doing

821
00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:14,680
and give good service.

822
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,240
What is the most times
a girl's booked clients

823
00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:19,040
in one night that you know of?

824
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,040
Probably the most
I've seen is 12.

825
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:26,080
-Wow.
-12 hours.

826
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:28,600
-12, so 12 clients in 12 hours?
-Yes.

827
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,600
Gayle, what would you say
is the future of
The Daily Planet?

828
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:33,880
Do you think this is a place
that will be long-standing?

829
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,560
Do you think it'll be
here in ten years?

830
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:38,840
I believe it would
be here in ten years,

831
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,640
in 20 years, maybe
even in 30 years.

832
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:46,520
This industry, um,
and there's lots and lots

833
00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:47,960
of brothels in Melbourne,

834
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,840
they exist because
there's a need for it.

835
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,840
It's not like we make
clients come in,

836
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,400
they come in because
they have a need.

837
00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:57,920
-Right.
-Um.

838
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:00,760
They've had the same need
for a long, long time.

839
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:02,360
And I can't see in the future

840
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,280
why that will alter.

841
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:06,720
So as they say, the
longest-running profession.

842
00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:09,760
-That it is, is quite correct.
-Okay.

843
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:11,360
[dramatic music]

844
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:18,760
[Nathan] But not all sex work
is as glamorous as
the Daily Planet.

845
00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:23,200
Here on notorious Grey Street,
in the beach-side
suburb of St Kilda,

846
00:34:23,240 --> 00:34:27,360
desperate girls ply
their trade nightly,
risking health and safety.

847
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,320
It stands in stark comparison
to the sleek cocktail bars

848
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:33,720
and expensive restaurants
that are within a stone's
throw of this corner.

849
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:35,160
A rather dark underbelly

850
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:36,680
to the city's polished exterior.

851
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:52,120
[Nathan] Of course,
it's not just heterosexuals
that are interested

852
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,040
in paying for sexual pleasure.

853
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,640
There is a booming industry here
for same-sex male escorts.

854
00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:02,400
I'm here to meet with Alex,
who's a male gigolo, about his
encounters and experiences.

855
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:05,360
He's agreed to do the interview
as long as we meet
in a public place,

856
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:07,160
so I'm not entirely sure
he's going to show up,

857
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:08,960
but fingers crossed.

858
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:15,360
-Alex, thanks for coming.
-Hi.

859
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:17,840
-So you're originally
from Thailand?
-Yes, I'm from Thailand.

860
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,600
Can you tell us how you
got the initial idea
to become an escort?

861
00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:26,240
Um, because of my visa,
it's very hard to get a job

862
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,240
and get out the schools
salary, or well-paid,

863
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:31,840
because if I work
in a restaurant,

864
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:34,880
like, work really hard,
like, we get just like,

865
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:38,640
uh, $10 per-- a, an hour.

866
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:41,440
I feel like I did that before

867
00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:42,720
and then it makes me sick,

868
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:44,240
or maybe I find something else.

869
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:45,640
And then, "How about just sex?,"

870
00:35:45,680 --> 00:35:49,400
because I like to
have sex on... too.

871
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:51,960
-[laughs]
-So as far as clientele
is concerned,

872
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,120
what is expected of you or from
you within your services?

873
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:57,520
Definitely he
expect sex from me,

874
00:35:57,560 --> 00:36:01,400
but, um, but we can't
have sex like whole days.

875
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,240
Uh, some clients,
they're going to do like a day

876
00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:06,720
or a whole night client.

877
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,960
They just like to
have a good company

878
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:12,280
with someone, and just
talking, and, like, happy.

879
00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:14,160
Now we just spend a time with,

880
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:15,680
and just make them happy,

881
00:36:15,720 --> 00:36:18,440
and then just sex just
once time, that's it.

882
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,240
Do you charge a lot
of money by the hour?

883
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,360
-How much do you charge?
-I'll charge a lot because

884
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:26,000
I don't want to work that much.

885
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:31,320
And I just up my rate
to $300 for an hour.

886
00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:33,880
And do you, uh, just work
in the one city,

887
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,480
or do you have clients that
fly you around Australia?

888
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,680
I got once, I'm--
they're from Gold Coast.

889
00:36:39,720 --> 00:36:42,880
Yeah, they come to holiday here

890
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:44,600
and then they ask me
to go back with them.

891
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:48,080
And in a Gold Coast
for three days,

892
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:49,640
and they pay me per days,

893
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:52,240
like, 2,000 something per day.

894
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:54,640
-$2,000 a day?
-Yeah.

895
00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:56,920
And do you practice safe sex?

896
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:58,040
Yes, always.

897
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,520
Except, [laughs]
I service my boyfriend's,

898
00:37:02,560 --> 00:37:04,680
he's someone I know very well.

899
00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:07,080
And your boyfriend know
what you do as an escort?

900
00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:09,720
-Yes.
-And he's comfortable with that?

901
00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:11,000
He's my client. [laughs]

902
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:12,160
-Really?
-Yeah.

903
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:14,600
-Wow, okay, interesting.
-[laughs]

904
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:16,800
Um, it sounds like
a weird question,

905
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:18,320
but do you enjoy what you do?

906
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,560
If you got a right client, like,

907
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:24,640
not really old, I'm sorry, like,

908
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:29,640
not, uh, really ugly and like
still have the good, uh, sex,

909
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:31,880
or hot sex, we still
enjoy good sex.

910
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,880
But sometime we have
to take care, like,

911
00:37:34,920 --> 00:37:36,480
"Sorry, like, very old

912
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:39,440
and... fat,"
and something like that,

913
00:37:39,480 --> 00:37:43,840
is quite, we have to force
ourselves to do that, uh.

914
00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:45,480
Okay.

915
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:47,000
[Nathan] Meeting Alex has
got me interested in

916
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:49,480
a type of gay dating
scene that exists here,

917
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:51,520
so I'm going to go and check
out Wet on Wellington,

918
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:55,080
which has been described
as Melbourne's finest
gay pool and sauna.

919
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:58,000
If you're a heterosexual
you probably don't even
know the place exists

920
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:00,040
and would never have
seen the inside.

921
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:02,760
We're going to go
and have a look before
the doors open for trade.

922
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:05,520
-G'day, Shane.
-G'day, Nathan, welcome
to Wet On Wellington.

923
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:07,960
Thank you. So can you tell us
a bit about the establishment?

924
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:09,960
Yeah, Wet On Wellington
is a venue

925
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:12,240
that's designed for
gay and bisexual men.

926
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,480
Uh, it's a, it's a safe
house, if you like,

927
00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:16,640
where they can come
and enjoy the company

928
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:22,160
of like-minded men,
um, in an area that,
um, affords them

929
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:26,200
the freedom to be able to
feel good about themselves

930
00:38:26,240 --> 00:38:28,040
and enjoy the facilities.

931
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:30,280
Our venue is probably rated as

932
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:31,920
probably number
one in Australia,

933
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,560
and probably within the top
five or six of the world.

934
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:36,600
We have a 25 meter
swimming pool.

935
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:38,920
We have saunas,
bar and steam rooms.

936
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:42,640
We have in a theater room
that plays, um, the latest DVDs.

937
00:38:42,680 --> 00:38:44,800
Computer area,
people can come here

938
00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:46,600
and use the Internet
free of charge,

939
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:50,000
so even for $20 entry
you could basically

940
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:52,360
sit, sit down all day on
the Internet if you want.

941
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:54,880
So, if you come here and you
don't find someone that

942
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,520
isn't to your liking,
you can jump on the Net
and invite them down.

943
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:02,040
So it's very relaxed
and it's like you cater
for all type of situations.

944
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,080
Absolutely.
Being gay and say, closeted

945
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:06,440
where you're not out to society,

946
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:09,760
you're quite limited to
where you can go, you know,

947
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:12,240
be it a bar or something
like that, to meet
like-minded people,

948
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:14,080
even just to talk.

949
00:39:14,120 --> 00:39:17,280
You can come in here and you
know that whoever you talk to,

950
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:19,320
you're not going to get
a smack in the ear.

951
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:21,440
[Nathan] I asked Shane to show
me around upstairs,

952
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:23,600
which has quite a reputation.

953
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:26,480
It is totally different
to the downstairs.

954
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:30,280
Uh, upstairs we have cubicles
and, um, play areas

955
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:31,800
for people to cruise around

956
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:33,400
and do what they do best.

957
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:34,960
-How do you say that?
-[Nathan laughs]

958
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,960
-Every room has
condoms and lube.
-Mm-hmm.

959
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:41,480
-How many rooms are
up here, Shane?
-31?

960
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:44,400
-31.
-Yeah, it's not for sleeping in.

961
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:46,840
[chuckles] Have a look at this.

962
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:50,480
-[Shane] What about
for yourself?
-[laughs]

963
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,640
So, a bit of role-playing
goes along here.

964
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:54,360
We call this a heavy duty room.

965
00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:57,240
All right, it does
look heavy-duty.

966
00:39:57,280 --> 00:39:59,400
-It does, yeah.
-Mm.

967
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:01,840
This area here is
the Suckitaurium.

968
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:04,080
Right, and what is
the Suckitaurium?

969
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:06,120
There's only one
way to tell you.

970
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:08,000
Basically, if you go
into the top area,

971
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:09,520
shove your dick through a hole,

972
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:11,360
and it's my head height.

973
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:13,320
So you just want to have a look
in say, the first one there.

974
00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:14,680
[Shane] See the hole here?

975
00:40:17,720 --> 00:40:19,920
-[Shane calling from outside]
-[Nathan] Oof.

976
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,520
-Wow.
-[Shane] A large
group play area.

977
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:24,560
What's, what type of scenario--

978
00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:27,480
what's a regular scenario that
would happen in in this room?

979
00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:30,600
Um, group playing, basically.

980
00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:33,600
Just people wanting to
get together in a group.

981
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:35,640
-That's quite popular.
-Okay.

982
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:37,600
Much to people's disbelief,

983
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:39,920
-people do like
playing in groups.
-Yeah.

984
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:42,200
The difference with
the two porn lounges...

985
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:47,920
is, this one we play
a younger style of porn,

986
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,840
and in the back one
we play more of a heavy duty,

987
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:55,960
so more of a manly
type porn up there,
younger type stuff here.

988
00:40:56,000 --> 00:41:00,800
We don't, um, play anything
that shows bare-backing,

989
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,880
in other words,
sex without condoms,

990
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:08,160
and we don't play, uh, any films
that show any form of violence.

991
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:09,320
-Right--
-It's all--

992
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:10,400
So, no sexual violence?

993
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:11,840
No sexual violence.

994
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:13,840
[Shane] We have our
code of conduct here

995
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:15,240
that people must abide by.

996
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:16,880
And they're written
in such a way that

997
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:18,400
people are meant to understand,

998
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:20,120
"No," means, "No."

999
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,000
-Great.
-Very, very simple.

1000
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:24,040
We push the safe sex
rule all the time,

1001
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,080
although you can't be
there watching everyone,

1002
00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:27,480
you know, it's important
part of our days lives

1003
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:29,400
whether you're straight or gay.

1004
00:41:29,440 --> 00:41:32,360
[Nathan] What sort of clients
do you have come here?

1005
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:36,040
Monday to Friday, 85% of people

1006
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:38,200
-that don't identify as gay.
-Mm-hmm.

1007
00:41:38,240 --> 00:41:42,240
On weekends, it's,
uh, probably 80%

1008
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:44,360
that do identify as gay.

1009
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:46,240
People that party
at other venues

1010
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:49,120
and then come here for
a relaxation afterwards,

1011
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:51,520
uh, for winding down, um,

1012
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:53,160
or people that just
come here to have sex.

1013
00:41:53,200 --> 00:41:55,400
So do people class
the venue as a brothel?

1014
00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:58,200
No, they don't.
Um, and it's totally

1015
00:41:58,240 --> 00:41:59,960
far removed from a brothel.

1016
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:01,880
The difference with
ourselves and a brothel is

1017
00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:04,880
with a brothel, you pay for sex.

1018
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,840
Here you're paying an entrance
fee to use the facilities.

1019
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:11,760
If by chance you meet someone

1020
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:14,240
and you choose to
have sex with them,

1021
00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:16,720
then that's totally void of us

1022
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:18,560
organizing it or doing
anything like that.

1023
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:21,640
We really are running a totally
straight up and down venue,

1024
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:26,640
uh, for the benefit of
gay and bisexual people
just to enjoy themselves.

1025
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,880
[Nathan] Wet On Wellington
was fascinating,
but I was about to embark

1026
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,040
on an even more
interesting adventure.

1027
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:34,680
-[lighthearted music]
-The famous French
sexual sadist,

1028
00:42:34,720 --> 00:42:37,440
the Marquis de Sade wrote,
"It is always by way of pain

1029
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:39,080
that one arrives at pleasure,"

1030
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:40,920
and out here at this little
quiet pocket of Melbourne

1031
00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:43,440
at what looks like a fairly
nondescript warehouse,

1032
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:45,520
but it's far more than that.
To someone walking past,

1033
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:48,240
they'd have no idea that
is in fact a dungeon.

1034
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:51,160
So I'm going to put my
inhibitions on hold
and take a peek inside.

1035
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,240
-Hi, it's nice to meet you.
-Thanks for having us.

1036
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:54,960
-Welcome to Fetish House.
-Thank you so much.

1037
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:56,440
And I'll give you
a bit of a tour.

1038
00:42:56,480 --> 00:42:57,960
Please do, that'll be great.

1039
00:42:58,000 --> 00:42:59,600
[Nathan] Dominatrix
Mistress Emmeline

1040
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:01,600
has offered to show me
around Fetish House,

1041
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,360
a six room bondage dungeon
that offers services

1042
00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:07,320
for the more sexually
adventurous.

1043
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:10,240
To start, we have our
cross-dressing room...

1044
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:11,960
-Okay.
-...Which is kitted out with

1045
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:13,760
pretty much every costume
you could ever need.

1046
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:16,040
-[Nathan] Oh, right.
-We've got regular
women's clothing

1047
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:17,520
as well as the more
fetish sort of things,

1048
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:19,000
if you like to dress
up as a schoolgirl,

1049
00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:21,440
or a police officer,
or anything you like.

1050
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:24,120
Someone will come in
and they'll have a fantasy

1051
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:27,560
about, um, being taught
how to walk like a woman,
how to speak...

1052
00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:30,120
-Oh, right.
-...how to dress,
how to walk in heels,

1053
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:34,040
which is harder than most of
them think. [laughs] And, yeah,
they just get dressed up.

1054
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,800
And, yeah, it's just
the perfect atmosphere
to get organized and girly.

1055
00:43:36,840 --> 00:43:39,160
[Nathan] Activities such as
role play, torture,

1056
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:42,560
and domination, are actively
promoted and recommended.

1057
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,600
And Mistress Emmeline
loves every minute of it.

1058
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:47,640
-Dungeon three.
-Yes.

1059
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:49,240
This has got the bondage bed

1060
00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:51,040
so you can actually lock
people up in there,

1061
00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:52,960
make sure they
don't go anywhere.

1062
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:55,720
Um, the suspension rack in
here is very popular.

1063
00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:57,600
But I like to call it
the slave of fortune

1064
00:43:57,640 --> 00:43:59,440
because you can spin
people around on it.

1065
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,000
-Okay, the slave of fortune.
-Yeah, it's a slave of fortune.

1066
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:04,760
-Wow.
-You just get strapped
in and enjoy the ride.

1067
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:08,560
-So it's very medieval.
-It is, yeah, a lot
of the torture and,

1068
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:11,440
um, you know, discipline is all
based around the medieval.

1069
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:13,680
[Nathan] Don't think I want to
get locked up in that!

1070
00:44:13,720 --> 00:44:15,560
Well, that's half
the fun [Emmeline laughs]

1071
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:17,840
-That's what
people come in for.
-You can spend some time

1072
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:19,520
in there if you've
been a bad puppy.

1073
00:44:19,560 --> 00:44:21,760
-[Nathan] Mm-hmm, alright.
-This is probably

1074
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:24,880
my favorite room.
This is the medical room.

1075
00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:28,200
It's, um, all authentic,
everything from
the naughty nurse

1076
00:44:28,240 --> 00:44:30,280
through the suturing.
And for example,

1077
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:32,200
you can suture the skin,

1078
00:44:32,240 --> 00:44:35,440
so a man no longer
appears to have a penis,

1079
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:38,640
so that can be part
of the cross-dressing

1080
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:40,560
transformation as well.

1081
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:42,920
Um, and you can also suture
different things,

1082
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:44,640
like, you can make
the corsets on the back.

1083
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:46,000
That's generally play piercing

1084
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:47,320
but that's all part
of it as well.

1085
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:49,320
Yeah, lots of blood play.

1086
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:50,480
-Right.
-Which is definitely

1087
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,760
an acquired taste. [laughs]

1088
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:55,240
-[Emmeline] This is
dungeon two...
-Yeah.

1089
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:58,920
-...which has got the cross,
which is always good.
-Mm-hmm.

1090
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,400
[Emmeline] Lots of nice
custom-made furniture.

1091
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:03,720
And this is probably
the most equipped room,

1092
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:07,640
in terms of, um, the more
pain inflicting devices.

1093
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:10,080
This one's got the horse,
it's got the table

1094
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:12,200
that you can twist them into
really awkward positions.

1095
00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:14,000
-Oh, okay.
-Yeah, the chair.

1096
00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:17,200
-So, it's, yeah, it's
a fantastic room for...
-Mm.

1097
00:45:17,240 --> 00:45:19,960
-...lots of the more
fetish side of things.
-So, torture chamber.

1098
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,600
[Nathan] All of these tools were
used for what's known as BDSM.

1099
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:28,120
[Emmeline] BDSM stands for
bondage, discipline,
sadomasochism.

1100
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:30,120
-Right.
-Um.

1101
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:35,160
It usually means bondage,
um, different restraints, um,

1102
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:37,000
the dominant/submissive role.

1103
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:40,320
-Do you have a high pain
threshold yourself?
-I do, yeah.

1104
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:44,400
I've got a high pain threshold
and a high bullshit tolerance.

1105
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:47,800
-[laughs]
-So, I do have to put up
with a lot of it sometimes.

1106
00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:49,280
What are the customers
like that come here,

1107
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:51,800
what sort of people
tend to come here?

1108
00:45:51,840 --> 00:45:54,160
Well, obviously it's not
just a bit of chump change,

1109
00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:56,200
like, you've got--
it's 240 for an hour.

1110
00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:59,800
-Yeah.
-And so, mostly,
we do see middle-class,

1111
00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:02,280
um, white-collar employees.

1112
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:05,960
I get a lot of, uh,
police officers and firemen.

1113
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:09,080
-Wow.
-But doing that, they like to
be in the submissive role,

1114
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:10,880
I'm assuming because
they like being in--

1115
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:12,760
they're in charge throughout
the rest of their lives,

1116
00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:15,440
-so they like letting
go of it a little bit...
-Okay.

1117
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:17,840
-...in their sexual life.
-So it's very much psychological

1118
00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:21,560
-as much as it is physical?
-Yes, often it's more
psychological than anything.

1119
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,440
-Right.
-A lot of the play
you've got to be hearty for it,

1120
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:27,000
and you've got to make sure
you know what you're getting
yourself into.

1121
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:30,200
Can you go too far, can some--
can a client go too far, or?

1122
00:46:30,240 --> 00:46:34,080
You have your safe limits,
and your safe words,
and your hard limits.

1123
00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:37,160
Um, a hard limit
is something that you
won't do no matter what.

1124
00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:41,640
And so, for me,
my hard limits are anything
to do with children,

1125
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:45,080
anything to do with animals,
and anything to do with scat.

1126
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:47,520
Anything else is
pretty much open game.

1127
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:50,040
[Nathan] Now that I knew Mistress Emmeline's hard limits,

1128
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:51,520
I thought I'd take
the opportunity

1129
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:53,680
to engage in a little
bondage myself.

1130
00:46:54,640 --> 00:46:57,560
So, what's this contraption?
I'm guessing I sort of...

1131
00:46:57,600 --> 00:46:58,880
-It's a horse.
-...bend over?

1132
00:46:58,920 --> 00:46:59,960
Yeah, I'll show you
what it does.

1133
00:47:00,000 --> 00:47:01,320
[Nathan chuckles]

1134
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:02,720
I'll give you the suede one.

1135
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:04,040
-Okay.
-[whip slaps]

1136
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:05,800
-Like that, yeah.
-Alright. Okay.

1137
00:47:05,840 --> 00:47:07,320
You just have to bend
over a little bit further

1138
00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:09,280
so you're a bit more
vulnerable, yeah.

1139
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:11,320
-Okay.
-[both laughing]

1140
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:13,200
See, that's the way it works.

1141
00:47:13,240 --> 00:47:15,360
And, look, as far as the levels
of hardcore are concerned,

1142
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:17,360
obviously, like, there's
so much that goes on here,

1143
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:19,720
and there must be
such a wide variety

1144
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,800
of customer requests,
and what you guys do,

1145
00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:24,720
but what would you
deem hardcore?

1146
00:47:24,760 --> 00:47:29,160
Severe caning would
have to be one of my...

1147
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:31,040
-the ones that make me cringe.
-Yeah.

1148
00:47:31,080 --> 00:47:33,240
We do get clients
that come in and they want

1149
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:35,640
you to make
them bleed with a cane,

1150
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:38,040
and to hit them that hard
with a cane is very--

1151
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:41,200
it's not only tiring for you
because your arms get sore,

1152
00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:43,800
but just the fact of
watching them is tiring,

1153
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:45,080
because you know
how much it hurts

1154
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:46,560
but they just love it.

1155
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,160
Wow. So this one here
looks quite severe.

1156
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,200
Yeah, that one actually
hurts a lot. [chuckles]

1157
00:47:52,240 --> 00:47:55,040
Usually put that around
the base of someone's

1158
00:47:55,080 --> 00:47:56,720
-dick and their balls.
-Mm-hmm.

1159
00:47:57,640 --> 00:47:59,400
Put their dick through there,

1160
00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:02,840
and if you get hard
it'll hurt a lot.

1161
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,240
[Nathan] There was one thing
that I'd always wanted to try,

1162
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:08,120
and luckily Mistress
Emmeline had one on hand.

1163
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:10,640
Um, this is a gimp mask.

1164
00:48:10,680 --> 00:48:12,560
It's used by gimps.

1165
00:48:12,600 --> 00:48:15,400
It's a really good way of
de-personalizing a slave

1166
00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:17,680
or a submissive. And so
we'll give you a shot.

1167
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:20,440
We'll see the difference.

1168
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:21,520
[laughs]

1169
00:48:23,560 --> 00:48:26,440
[Nathan] It was not the most comfortable thing I'd ever worn

1170
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:28,840
and very claustrophobic.

1171
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:30,200
You know, if they talk
too much you can

1172
00:48:30,240 --> 00:48:31,960
just get rid of them like that.

1173
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:33,840
Can shut them up.

1174
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,320
-[Nathan mumbles]
-[Emmeline laughs]

1175
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:40,600
We'll put the dildo
in there. [laughs]

1176
00:48:40,640 --> 00:48:42,440
[Nathan chuckles]

1177
00:48:42,480 --> 00:48:44,880
Yeah, now you panic. [laughs]

1178
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:46,800
[upbeat music]

1179
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:55,280
From everything I've seen,
Melbourne has an extensive
and varied sex industry.

1180
00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:59,680
Is that a good thing?
What are the benefits, if any,
of legalized prostitution?

1181
00:48:59,720 --> 00:49:01,640
I'm here to talk with
Project Respect,

1182
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:05,240
a sex worker support
organization,
to find out their view.

1183
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:08,440
Project Respect has outreach
to women in the sex industry,

1184
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:10,840
so we visit women in brothels,

1185
00:49:10,880 --> 00:49:14,120
-Right.
-We also build up
understanding and awareness

1186
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:17,080
about trafficking with other
women in the sex industry,

1187
00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:19,720
so, you know, women will
tell us about trafficking

1188
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:21,560
that they know of,
and even brothel owners

1189
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:23,040
might tell us about, you know,

1190
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:25,320
trafficking in other,
uh, brothels.

1191
00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:28,120
Approximately how many
brothels do you know of
that are operating in Melbourne?

1192
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:32,840
There's 90 to 95
licensed brothels,

1193
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:36,720
and I've heard 130
unlicensed brothels.

1194
00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:38,720
As far as women
that are trafficked

1195
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:40,280
to Melbourne for sex work.

1196
00:49:40,320 --> 00:49:41,960
We estimate that
there's probably

1197
00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:44,400
300 women trafficked
to Melbourne every year.

1198
00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:45,920
-Right.
-We'd say about a thousand

1199
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,400
women trafficked to
Australia every year.

1200
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:50,200
And where were they coming from?

1201
00:49:50,240 --> 00:49:52,040
They tend to come from Asia.

1202
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:53,760
At the moment it
seems like most women

1203
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:55,920
are coming from South Korea,

1204
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:58,360
but in the past,
Thailand has been the place

1205
00:49:58,400 --> 00:49:59,840
where most women have come from,

1206
00:49:59,880 --> 00:50:02,600
with other women from
Malaysia, China,

1207
00:50:02,640 --> 00:50:04,960
uh, the Philippines, Taiwan.

1208
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:06,440
Do we know who brings them?

1209
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:08,840
It seems to me that
there's a link with

1210
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:12,800
ethnic groups and kind of,
I guess, ethnic based mafia,

1211
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:16,600
um, but I think, you know,
Australians are also,

1212
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:20,520
certainly Australian
citizens are involved in
and exploiting women here.

1213
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:23,720
Are these trafficked women
working in these
illegal brothels then?

1214
00:50:23,760 --> 00:50:27,600
No, trafficked women are
kept in legal brothels.

1215
00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:29,080
-In legal?
-Yes.

1216
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:30,960
Wow, okay.

1217
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:34,800
Every case that has been
investigated and prosecuted

1218
00:50:34,840 --> 00:50:38,760
in Australia of trafficking,
has involved trafficking
into legal brothels,

1219
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:41,560
and all the women who we know of
were kept in legal brothels.

1220
00:50:41,600 --> 00:50:45,000
[Nathan] I really wanted to ask
Nina about Club 417,

1221
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:48,760
the most famous case
of prosecuted sex
trafficking in Melbourne.

1222
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:50,360
So...

1223
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:53,920
Club 417 is a brothel on
Brunswick Street in Fitzroy

1224
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:57,160
in the heart of our cafe strip.

1225
00:50:57,200 --> 00:50:59,840
Um, it's a pretty nondescript
little place, you walk past it,

1226
00:50:59,880 --> 00:51:01,720
you probably think
that it's just, you know,

1227
00:51:01,760 --> 00:51:04,560
an empty shop,
but it's a brothel.

1228
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,480
And in 2003,
the police did a raid

1229
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:12,000
and they found five
trafficked women in there.

1230
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:14,280
They charged the
brothel owner Wei Tang

1231
00:51:14,320 --> 00:51:16,520
and her manager Paul Pick

1232
00:51:16,560 --> 00:51:19,080
with possessing
and using slaves.

1233
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:21,720
They were told that
they owed her debts of

1234
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:25,760
between 45 and 90
thousand dollars

1235
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:27,320
which they had to
pay off by doing

1236
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:28,880
prostitution in her brothel.

1237
00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:31,840
They paid it off
within a few months,

1238
00:51:31,880 --> 00:51:35,240
and it means that
they were doing

1239
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:38,000
about ten clients a night,

1240
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:41,960
every single night
for three months.

1241
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:46,520
Which in itself
is an incredible,

1242
00:51:46,560 --> 00:51:48,200
you know, toll on your body.

1243
00:51:48,240 --> 00:51:50,640
It was about 800 or 900 men

1244
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:51,800
that each of the women did

1245
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:54,680
before they paid off the debt.

1246
00:51:54,720 --> 00:51:56,800
And again, it's one
of those things

1247
00:51:56,840 --> 00:51:58,560
that if you really
think about it...

1248
00:52:00,120 --> 00:52:02,800
it's-- I don't think
that anyone can fail

1249
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:07,240
to understand how
corrosive and degrading

1250
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:09,200
the experience of
being trafficked is.

1251
00:52:09,240 --> 00:52:11,880
[Nathan] That led
to the question,
did Nina think there

1252
00:52:11,920 --> 00:52:16,280
was a difference
between legal prostitution
and illegal sex trafficking?

1253
00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:19,200
Having legal brothels
in Victoria,

1254
00:52:19,240 --> 00:52:22,160
I think can make it easier
to hide trafficked women,

1255
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:24,440
because there is an
assumption that brothels

1256
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:26,800
are safe if they are regulated,

1257
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:29,240
that they're, you know,
that they're following

1258
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:30,520
laws and regulations.

1259
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:32,080
But really, what...

1260
00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:36,880
What shapes whether or not
we have trafficked women,

1261
00:52:36,920 --> 00:52:40,320
is whether or not we accept
prostitution at all.

1262
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:43,760
Project Respect is adamant
about the harms and
costs of prostitution,

1263
00:52:43,800 --> 00:52:45,200
legal or otherwise.

1264
00:52:45,240 --> 00:52:46,800
So in order to get
another opinion,

1265
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:48,920
I've been invited to
a rally for abortion rights

1266
00:52:48,960 --> 00:52:52,120
by the president of this trans
sex party, Fiona Patten.

1267
00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:55,720
On a very wet, cold,
rainy, Melbourne day,

1268
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:58,920
um, we're out showing
our support for

1269
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:01,440
the abortion clinic behind us.

1270
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:03,800
-Yeah.
-[Fiona] Every third Saturday,
a group of,

1271
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:04,920
I can't remember
what they're called,

1272
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:06,560
something with the Virgin Mary,

1273
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:10,240
come and pray, and harass
some of the clients

1274
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:12,920
who come to this
clinic, um, during the day,

1275
00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:15,720
-[Nathan] Right.
-And we're here to show our
support for the clinic.

1276
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:18,520
It's so important that women
have that right to choose,

1277
00:53:18,560 --> 00:53:20,920
and I-- you know,
we've seen that

1278
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:23,560
when women don't have control
of their reproductive rights,

1279
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:25,040
they take it into
their own hands,

1280
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:27,040
and we see backyard
abortions setting up,

1281
00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:30,560
and we see very,
you know, unsafe practices.

1282
00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:32,160
Frankly, you know,
it would be great if we had

1283
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:34,120
really good sex education,

1284
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:35,880
and that would probably mean
that we would have

1285
00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:37,600
less abortions in this country.

1286
00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:40,200
But they-- it needs to
remain legal and safe.

1287
00:53:40,240 --> 00:53:41,800
[Nathan] So, more money
in education?

1288
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:43,880
[Fiona] More sex education
would definitely mean

1289
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:45,600
less unwanted pregnancies.

1290
00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:47,600
[Nathan] I also wanted to ask
Fiona's opinion

1291
00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:50,120
about legalized
prostitution in Melbourne.

1292
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:53,840
I am all in favor
for sex workers

1293
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:55,600
to be able to work
legally and safely.

1294
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:58,040
-[crowd chants]
-Um, but I would
probably support

1295
00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:01,120
a decriminalized system
rather than legalization,

1296
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:03,880
which is about treating
the sex industry

1297
00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:05,480
as any other business.

1298
00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:07,960
So, whether you're
a hairdresser or a sex worker,

1299
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:10,080
you have the same rights
and responsibilities.

1300
00:54:10,120 --> 00:54:13,000
What's your take on the number
of legalized brothels

1301
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:14,800
that are actually
here in Melbourne?

1302
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:16,920
Unfortunately,
it's, it's actually

1303
00:54:16,960 --> 00:54:18,880
probably over regulated here.

1304
00:54:18,920 --> 00:54:21,200
And it was sort of,
when they introduced the laws,

1305
00:54:21,240 --> 00:54:23,080
it was like, "Well,
you know, we want to

1306
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:25,360
protect the workers,
but we don't want to be seen

1307
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:27,080
to condone the industry."

1308
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:29,480
So they set up very
draconian laws,

1309
00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:30,920
which means that probably

1310
00:54:30,960 --> 00:54:33,040
two thirds of the
industry in Melbourne

1311
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:34,960
work-- it operates illegally.

1312
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:37,000
So, for every one legal brothel,

1313
00:54:37,040 --> 00:54:39,880
you have two or three
illegal brothels operating.

1314
00:54:39,920 --> 00:54:43,040
Uh, I certainly think a system

1315
00:54:43,080 --> 00:54:45,640
where brothels
can operate legally,

1316
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:48,360
and we have good health
and safety codes,

1317
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:52,880
and women can work without fear
of, you know, exploitation

1318
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:57,200
is a very good path.
And Melbourne has gone
some way to it,

1319
00:54:57,240 --> 00:54:58,960
but, you know,
it could be better.

1320
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:01,360
[Nathan] Do you believe that
legalized prostitution

1321
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:03,120
discourages trafficking?

1322
00:55:03,160 --> 00:55:06,840
I certainly do when it's
well-managed and well run.

1323
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:09,720
So, as I was saying
before, I actually think

1324
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:12,960
with a legalized system,
we should actually enable

1325
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:14,840
workers from other
countries to work here

1326
00:55:14,880 --> 00:55:17,360
safely and legally.
And that, I think

1327
00:55:17,400 --> 00:55:19,040
could be done through
a visa system.

1328
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:21,400
So, when you do have
a legal system

1329
00:55:21,440 --> 00:55:23,400
where they're not having
to work underground

1330
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:25,880
and hidden away, you can control

1331
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:28,280
and police the industry
far more easily.

1332
00:55:28,320 --> 00:55:30,280
[Nathan] That led me to
my final question,

1333
00:55:30,320 --> 00:55:32,520
which was whether Melbourne
was becoming more liberal

1334
00:55:32,560 --> 00:55:34,880
or conservative in
its approach to sex?

1335
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:37,240
Well, thankfully,
I think Australians

1336
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:39,600
are becoming far more
liberal in their approach,

1337
00:55:39,640 --> 00:55:43,040
and you can only see that like,
in the statistics about
who supports gay marriage

1338
00:55:43,080 --> 00:55:47,000
or, you know, is opposed
to Internet censorship.

1339
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:48,680
But unfortunately,

1340
00:55:48,720 --> 00:55:51,840
our politicians are going
the opposite direction,

1341
00:55:51,880 --> 00:55:53,960
and I think they,
they tend to listen

1342
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:57,800
to small minority groups like
the people across the street,

1343
00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:01,520
um, and kowtow to them rather
than listening to the majority.

1344
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:03,560
-Thank you so much
for your time.
-Thanks, Nathan.

1345
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:04,960
-It's been a pleasure.
-Thank you, likewise.

1346
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:06,360
Thank you, Fiona.

1347
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:08,320
[upbeat music]

1348
00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:14,160
[Nathan] It's my last few
hours in Melbourne,

1349
00:56:14,200 --> 00:56:15,560
I've finally had
a chance to sample

1350
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:18,080
some of its much
celebrated coffee.

1351
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:19,960
The city is modern
and cosmopolitan.

1352
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:21,480
It has impressive skyscrapers

1353
00:56:21,520 --> 00:56:23,160
and expensive restaurants.

1354
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:25,400
I've seen all aspects
of its sexual culture

1355
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:27,040
and it's been a real eye-opener.

1356
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:29,520
There's a history of liberal
sexual attitude here,

1357
00:56:29,560 --> 00:56:31,200
but there's clearly a debate

1358
00:56:31,240 --> 00:56:32,560
between those who
want more freedom

1359
00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:34,400
and those who want
to restrict it.

1360
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:36,280
And although the sex
industry, legal and illegal,

1361
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:38,360
is all around them,
Melburnians seem to go about

1362
00:56:38,400 --> 00:56:41,200
their daily lives without
giving it a second glance.

1363
00:56:41,240 --> 00:56:42,520
For those involved, however,

1364
00:56:42,560 --> 00:56:44,400
it can be lucrative,
exhilarating,

1365
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:46,200
and dangerous to
both body and mind.

1366
00:56:46,240 --> 00:56:47,720
It's been a fascinating journey,

1367
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:49,000
and I'm glad I've
had the opportunity

1368
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:50,880
to experience such a unique city

1369
00:56:50,920 --> 00:56:53,000
with its own
distinctive culture.

1370
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:55,000
For now though,
it's time to leave.

1371
00:56:55,040 --> 00:56:56,880
[upbeat music]

1372
00:57:24,040 --> 00:57:26,600
[theme music]