1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:05,133 (Somber music) 2 00:00:13,733 --> 00:00:18,733 (Thunder) (Ominous music) 3 00:00:25,067 --> 00:00:27,600 [Voiceover] He's reaching out, really, for the downtrodden 4 00:00:27,600 --> 00:00:30,933 Of society, for the average Joe on the street who wants 5 00:00:30,933 --> 00:00:33,267 To look up to his lyrics and his music and say, 6 00:00:33,267 --> 00:00:35,700 "Hey, this man's talking my language." 7 00:00:43,533 --> 00:00:45,167 [Voiceover] You guys don't like explaining anything 8 00:00:45,167 --> 00:00:46,433 To do with your music... 9 00:00:46,433 --> 00:00:47,367 [Voiceover] There's nothing to be said, 10 00:00:47,367 --> 00:00:48,733 It's all in the music, man. 11 00:00:48,733 --> 00:00:50,200 It's all in the music. 12 00:00:51,333 --> 00:00:53,333 [Voiceover] If there was a John Lennon-type figure 13 00:00:53,333 --> 00:00:56,333 For the so-called "Generation X," it would be Cobain. 14 00:00:56,967 --> 00:00:58,467 [Voiceover] The body of Nirvana leader Kurt Cobain 15 00:00:58,467 --> 00:01:00,767 Was found in a house in Seattle on Friday morning, 16 00:01:00,767 --> 00:01:03,167 Dead of an apparently self-inflicted shotgun blast 17 00:01:03,167 --> 00:01:04,667 To the head. 18 00:01:04,933 --> 00:01:07,533 [Voiceover] An electrician hired to work on Cobain's home 19 00:01:07,533 --> 00:01:10,300 Walked up to this room above Cobain's garage 20 00:01:10,300 --> 00:01:12,800 And made the shocking discovery this morning. 21 00:01:13,267 --> 00:01:14,867 [Voiceover] A suicide note was found. 22 00:01:14,867 --> 00:01:16,433 [Voiceover] This is a puzzling case, 23 00:01:16,433 --> 00:01:18,433 A very disturbing case. 24 00:01:19,267 --> 00:01:22,133 [Voiceover] It first got reported that Kurt was missing 25 00:01:22,133 --> 00:01:26,167 And Courtney Love hired private investigator Tom Grant. 26 00:01:26,167 --> 00:01:27,100 [Voiceover] I had been involved in 27 00:01:27,100 --> 00:01:29,300 Missing persons cases before. 28 00:01:29,300 --> 00:01:31,933 Some red flags started popping up immediately, 29 00:01:31,933 --> 00:01:35,667 So I began recording every conversation I had with Courtney 30 00:01:35,667 --> 00:01:38,333 During the entire period that I worked for her. 31 00:01:38,767 --> 00:01:42,633 [Voiceover] My name is (Indistinct) 32 00:01:42,633 --> 00:01:45,200 [Voiceover] It could be made to look like a suicide. 33 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,533 [Voiceover] People that I had do this, I paid. 34 00:01:47,533 --> 00:01:49,067 [Voiceover] I've walked into cases that looked 35 00:01:49,067 --> 00:01:51,200 Like they were suicides that turned out to be homicides. 36 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:52,767 [Voiceover] Cobain's wife, singer Courtney Love, 37 00:01:52,767 --> 00:01:54,867 Was in England on tour with her band Hole 38 00:01:54,867 --> 00:01:56,300 When the body was discovered. 39 00:01:56,300 --> 00:01:58,200 [Voiceover] As it is, she has inherited an estate 40 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:00,167 Worth tens of millions of dollars. 41 00:02:00,167 --> 00:02:01,567 That's motive. 42 00:02:01,567 --> 00:02:02,933 [Voiceover] Did Courtney Love kill Kurt Cobain? 43 00:02:02,933 --> 00:02:05,833 Did she have a hand in any kind of conspiracy? 44 00:02:05,833 --> 00:02:10,800 These are favorite topics of fanatics. 45 00:02:11,733 --> 00:02:13,633 [Voiceover] There's nothing in the medical examiner's 46 00:02:13,633 --> 00:02:16,500 Report or coroner's reports that could not have easily 47 00:02:16,500 --> 00:02:18,867 Have been duplicated by a murderer. 48 00:02:18,867 --> 00:02:21,267 [Voiceover] It's entirely possible that a police officer, 49 00:02:21,267 --> 00:02:24,967 No matter how well-trained, may not see or notice 50 00:02:24,967 --> 00:02:27,133 A particular item of evidence. 51 00:02:27,133 --> 00:02:29,133 [Voiceover] Kurt Cobain was not barricaded 52 00:02:29,133 --> 00:02:30,367 Inside the room. 53 00:02:30,367 --> 00:02:32,600 He did not leave his driver's license out. 54 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:34,800 No one would believe that was a suicide note. 55 00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:36,933 Kurt Cobain was injected with three times 56 00:02:36,933 --> 00:02:39,533 The lethal dose of heroin. 57 00:02:39,533 --> 00:02:41,500 The media was getting this wrong. 58 00:02:43,933 --> 00:02:48,933 (Thunder) (Rain) 59 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:56,074 Everyone is intimidated by a shark. Become a Card Shark AMERICASCARDROOM.COM 60 00:03:02,833 --> 00:03:07,833 (Ominous music) 61 00:03:28,167 --> 00:03:29,833 Are you sure he's not in there? 62 00:03:32,700 --> 00:03:35,067 I knocked for at least five minutes. 63 00:03:35,700 --> 00:03:37,467 If he's there he would have answered. 64 00:03:37,967 --> 00:03:39,700 Alright, I just don't wanna end up 65 00:03:39,700 --> 00:03:41,767 On the wrong end of a shotgun. 66 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:53,133 Let's go. 67 00:04:12,067 --> 00:04:13,400 [Dylan] Careful. 68 00:04:22,733 --> 00:04:24,467 [Dylan] Kurt? 69 00:04:24,467 --> 00:04:26,067 Kurt! 70 00:04:55,867 --> 00:04:56,700 [Tom] If we find it we're gonna have 71 00:04:56,700 --> 00:04:58,067 To take it, right? 72 00:04:58,633 --> 00:05:00,067 [Dylan] Yeah. 73 00:05:00,633 --> 00:05:02,367 Which I can legally do since I bought it. 74 00:05:02,367 --> 00:05:04,067 It's in my name, so... 75 00:05:05,633 --> 00:05:07,500 [Tom] Not here, could it be under the bed? 76 00:05:07,567 --> 00:05:08,700 [Dylan] Might be. 77 00:05:11,267 --> 00:05:13,433 [Tom] No. Alright, let's move this. 78 00:05:16,067 --> 00:05:17,433 Alright, what is this? 79 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:19,067 This mean anything to ya? 80 00:05:19,067 --> 00:05:20,900 [Dylan] Rohypnol, that's where they are. 81 00:05:20,900 --> 00:05:22,067 [Tom] What? 82 00:05:22,067 --> 00:05:23,300 He kept saying someone stole 'em, 83 00:05:23,300 --> 00:05:25,400 But they've been sitting there. 84 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,533 These are what he OD'ed on in Rome. 85 00:05:27,533 --> 00:05:29,200 [Tom] Well she didn't want us to take those. 86 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:30,367 Yeah. 87 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,067 [Tom] Uh, wait a minute. 88 00:05:33,067 --> 00:05:34,400 Would she be okay if you keep 'em? 89 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:35,500 [Dylan] Yeah. 90 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:43,200 Are they legal here? 91 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:45,067 [Dylan] Yeah, they're completely legal, they're like... 92 00:05:45,067 --> 00:05:46,467 [Tom] What are they used for? 93 00:05:46,467 --> 00:05:47,900 [Dylan] They're sold as a sedative for 94 00:05:47,900 --> 00:05:50,533 Sleeping ailments, and sometimes they're given to people... 95 00:05:50,533 --> 00:05:51,900 [Tom] And if we get pulled over, you're not 96 00:05:51,900 --> 00:05:53,767 Gonna get arrested for havin' those? 97 00:05:53,767 --> 00:05:55,600 [Dylan] No, they're fine. 98 00:05:57,967 --> 00:06:00,700 Well it's obviously not here, the shotgun. 99 00:06:00,700 --> 00:06:04,100 No, and I dunno where it would be. 100 00:06:12,533 --> 00:06:13,233 [Tom] Is there anywhere else? 101 00:06:13,233 --> 00:06:14,267 [Dylan] No. 102 00:06:15,167 --> 00:06:16,333 [Tom] Okay. 103 00:06:17,067 --> 00:06:22,067 (Ominous music) 104 00:08:21,167 --> 00:08:22,833 My name is Tom Grant. 105 00:08:22,833 --> 00:08:25,067 I was hired by Courtney Love to find her missing 106 00:08:25,067 --> 00:08:29,067 Husband, Kurt Cobain, in April of 1994. 107 00:08:32,167 --> 00:08:35,467 My father was a schoolteacher, 108 00:08:35,467 --> 00:08:39,133 And this is a man I never caught one time 109 00:08:39,133 --> 00:08:41,533 In my entire life telling a lie. 110 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:46,467 He was the best role model anybody can ask for. 111 00:08:47,867 --> 00:08:50,800 By the time I became a junior in high school, 112 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:53,967 I definitely wanted to be a police officer. 113 00:08:54,733 --> 00:08:57,067 Graduating from the L.A. County Sheriff's Department 114 00:08:57,067 --> 00:09:01,067 Was a very proud day for me and for my family. 115 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:04,067 My first assignment was a patrol division 116 00:09:04,067 --> 00:09:06,700 At West Hollywood Sheriff Station. 117 00:09:10,500 --> 00:09:14,133 When I quit the department, I quit in very high standing. 118 00:09:14,133 --> 00:09:15,967 From there I moved on, took the test 119 00:09:15,967 --> 00:09:19,167 And obtained my own private investigator's license. 120 00:09:26,133 --> 00:09:30,267 I believe what makes me a good P.I. is that I always apply 121 00:09:30,267 --> 00:09:33,867 Logic and common sense to everything that I do. 122 00:09:35,133 --> 00:09:38,933 I've seen a lot of suicides, a lot of murders, 123 00:09:38,933 --> 00:09:42,067 And I don't try to pre-determine anything. 124 00:09:43,533 --> 00:09:46,067 And if I feel that my client, that's coming to me 125 00:09:46,067 --> 00:09:50,267 For help, is in the wrong based on what they're telling me, 126 00:09:50,267 --> 00:09:52,600 I'll let them know, "This could be a pretty" 127 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,867 "Dangerous trip for you." 128 00:09:54,867 --> 00:09:57,733 Scratch the surface of most P.I.s and you don't find a clean 129 00:09:57,733 --> 00:10:00,000 Record, you find a lotta skeletons. 130 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:01,600 And then we met Tom Grant. 131 00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:04,100 It turned out he had an exemplary record. 132 00:10:04,100 --> 00:10:06,967 He was respected, he was a stand-up guy. 133 00:10:06,967 --> 00:10:09,500 There was a consensus, and that went a long way 134 00:10:09,500 --> 00:10:12,467 To convincing us of his credibility. 135 00:10:12,467 --> 00:10:15,400 The word conspiracy is actually a legal term. 136 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:18,733 It simply means two or more people plotting 137 00:10:18,733 --> 00:10:21,367 Or planning to commit a crime. 138 00:10:21,367 --> 00:10:24,467 Even committing shoplifting with another person 139 00:10:24,467 --> 00:10:27,467 Can actually be charged with conspiracy. 140 00:10:28,300 --> 00:10:31,500 When somebody refers to me as a conspiracy theorist, 141 00:10:31,500 --> 00:10:35,133 I take it as an insult because I know what they mean by it. 142 00:10:35,833 --> 00:10:38,833 Hiring me is not like hiring an attorney. 143 00:10:38,833 --> 00:10:43,100 It's not to protect you, it's not to keep you outta jail. 144 00:10:43,100 --> 00:10:46,500 My job as a private investigator is to find the truth. 145 00:10:46,500 --> 00:10:49,633 It's simply to find the truth in the matter 146 00:10:49,633 --> 00:10:51,967 That you're hiring me for. 147 00:10:54,900 --> 00:10:59,900 (Eerie music) 148 00:11:03,267 --> 00:11:06,367 On Easter Sunday, I was in my office 149 00:11:06,367 --> 00:11:09,067 With a private investigator who worked for me 150 00:11:09,067 --> 00:11:11,200 Named Ben Klugman, and we were dealing 151 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:14,167 With a client when the phone rang. 152 00:11:14,167 --> 00:11:15,700 (Phone ringing) 153 00:11:15,700 --> 00:11:16,967 Now who calls on Easter? 154 00:11:16,967 --> 00:11:19,500 Would you excuse us for just a second? 155 00:11:20,533 --> 00:11:22,400 The Grant Company, how may I help you? 156 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:24,867 [Tom] And it was a woman's voice on the other end, 157 00:11:24,867 --> 00:11:26,700 Kind of a raspy, low voice. 158 00:11:26,700 --> 00:11:29,167 Now if someone is unlawfully using your credit cards, 159 00:11:29,167 --> 00:11:31,667 Maybe the police are the better people to call. 160 00:11:31,667 --> 00:11:34,233 [Tom] And then she said, "My husband and I are" 161 00:11:34,233 --> 00:11:38,267 "Kinda famous, and we need to get this done right away." 162 00:11:39,933 --> 00:11:41,233 And your husband's name? 163 00:11:41,233 --> 00:11:42,567 Are you kidding me? 164 00:11:42,567 --> 00:11:43,833 No, no. 165 00:11:43,833 --> 00:11:46,067 I was about 47 at the time; Ben Klugman, 166 00:11:46,067 --> 00:11:48,133 My investigator, was 29. 167 00:11:48,133 --> 00:11:50,333 He immediately knew who they were 168 00:11:50,333 --> 00:11:53,600 And what had been going on, even in Rome 169 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:55,233 Just a few weeks earlier. 170 00:11:55,233 --> 00:11:57,833 Because it was a holiday, of course, there were very few, 171 00:11:57,833 --> 00:12:00,967 If any, other private investigators working, so she went 172 00:12:00,967 --> 00:12:03,233 Through the Yellow Pages and she found our ad 173 00:12:03,233 --> 00:12:06,367 And I was probably one of many that she called, 174 00:12:06,367 --> 00:12:07,833 And I think she was probably surprised 175 00:12:07,833 --> 00:12:09,767 To have the phone picked up. 176 00:12:09,767 --> 00:12:11,300 What room number? 177 00:12:12,067 --> 00:12:15,067 It's not very often that a private investigator goes 178 00:12:15,067 --> 00:12:18,933 Against his client, so I'm sure she regrets hiring me. 179 00:12:22,267 --> 00:12:24,100 When we were available to meet Courtney 180 00:12:24,100 --> 00:12:27,633 At the Peninsula Hotel, first thing she said, 181 00:12:27,633 --> 00:12:30,100 And this is her words, they're not mine, 182 00:12:32,933 --> 00:12:37,200 You leak this to the press, I'll sue the fuck out of you. 183 00:12:38,833 --> 00:12:41,500 Well, hello to you too. (Laughing) 184 00:12:41,500 --> 00:12:43,167 How ya doin'? 185 00:12:46,067 --> 00:12:48,133 Kurtis came from rehab a couple days ago. 186 00:12:48,133 --> 00:12:49,833 He bought a ticket back to Seattle, but nobody's seen him 187 00:12:49,833 --> 00:12:51,267 Since he got back. 188 00:12:51,267 --> 00:12:53,267 When I first entered the room, she was wearing 189 00:12:53,267 --> 00:12:58,067 A negligee nightgown, totally see-through. 190 00:12:58,067 --> 00:13:01,700 She might as well have had nothing on whatsoever. 191 00:13:04,067 --> 00:13:05,267 [Courtney] I called the credit card companies 192 00:13:05,267 --> 00:13:07,333 And told them that the card was stolen 193 00:13:07,333 --> 00:13:09,067 And that they should cancel it. 194 00:13:11,233 --> 00:13:12,333 [Tom] Was it? 195 00:13:12,900 --> 00:13:14,067 [Courtney] What? 196 00:13:15,067 --> 00:13:16,533 [Tom] Stolen. 197 00:13:16,533 --> 00:13:18,067 [Courtney] No. 198 00:13:18,567 --> 00:13:21,400 Courtney eventually told us that Kurt's credit card 199 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:24,067 Actually wasn't stolen, that she had called the 200 00:13:24,067 --> 00:13:27,633 Credit card company and canceled it so that nobody 201 00:13:27,633 --> 00:13:29,067 Could use it. 202 00:13:29,067 --> 00:13:31,600 She felt that that would, essentially, cut him off 203 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:33,800 From any funds. 204 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:36,433 I'm sure your husband has another way of getting money. 205 00:13:36,433 --> 00:13:37,800 [Courtney] Are you kidding me? 206 00:13:37,800 --> 00:13:39,700 Kurt is helpless, he doesn't have any friends. 207 00:13:39,700 --> 00:13:42,300 Again, in her words, "You don't understand." 208 00:13:42,300 --> 00:13:43,567 "This guy can't even catch a..." 209 00:13:43,567 --> 00:13:46,100 Fucking cab by himself if he wanted to! 210 00:13:46,833 --> 00:13:47,600 [Woman] Hey. 211 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:48,800 [Courtney] Hey. 212 00:13:56,933 --> 00:13:58,600 That's my drug dealer. 213 00:14:00,600 --> 00:14:02,300 I didn't know at the time that this was supposed 214 00:14:02,300 --> 00:14:04,933 To be an in-house rehab. 215 00:14:04,933 --> 00:14:08,667 I learned that later, but a total farce. 216 00:14:08,667 --> 00:14:10,800 Most of the time I was with her, she was either 217 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:13,667 On drugs or doing drugs. 218 00:14:13,667 --> 00:14:16,333 There was nobody overseeing what was going on there. 219 00:14:16,333 --> 00:14:18,600 [Courtney] Listen, Kurt escaped from rehab, 220 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:21,367 He bought a shotgun, and I just feel like something bad 221 00:14:21,367 --> 00:14:22,900 Is gonna happen, okay? 222 00:14:22,900 --> 00:14:25,533 In the middle of all this conversation, she keeps talking 223 00:14:25,533 --> 00:14:28,100 About how suicidal he is, and how everybody thinks 224 00:14:28,100 --> 00:14:29,800 He's gonna commit suicide. 225 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:30,867 [Courtney] Everybody knows it, everybody thinks 226 00:14:30,867 --> 00:14:31,867 He's gonna die. 227 00:14:31,867 --> 00:14:33,067 Hold on a second. 228 00:14:33,067 --> 00:14:35,067 If he bought a shotgun and he's suicidal, 229 00:14:35,067 --> 00:14:36,567 Then dealing with this credit card problem, 230 00:14:36,567 --> 00:14:39,200 That's the least important thing we could help you with. 231 00:14:39,867 --> 00:14:43,233 [Courtney] Okay, well that's where I want you to start. 232 00:14:45,067 --> 00:14:47,867 She started off with a lie when we first talked to her 233 00:14:47,867 --> 00:14:50,867 On the phone, saying why she wanted to hire us, 234 00:14:50,867 --> 00:14:54,233 Which wasn't true, and then she starts telling us 235 00:14:54,233 --> 00:14:56,267 These other things that just didn't add up. 236 00:14:56,267 --> 00:14:58,733 They weren't logical, they didn't make sense. 237 00:14:58,733 --> 00:15:01,733 So all kinds of red flags started popping up. 238 00:15:01,733 --> 00:15:03,100 I dunno what's gonna happen with this case, 239 00:15:03,100 --> 00:15:05,933 But we are gonna document everything. 240 00:15:06,567 --> 00:15:09,067 Looking back on that day, it turned out to be a day 241 00:15:09,067 --> 00:15:13,533 That really changed my life forever. 242 00:15:13,533 --> 00:15:16,200 The name Kurt Cobain goes through my mind, 243 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:19,900 Probably three or 400 times a day, at least, 244 00:15:19,900 --> 00:15:24,100 And it has for the last 20 years, by necessity, 245 00:15:24,100 --> 00:15:26,633 Because of the e-mails I get, the letters I get, 246 00:15:26,633 --> 00:15:29,933 And all the other stuff, because he was so famous, 247 00:15:29,933 --> 00:15:33,900 And it gets a little bit old after a while, 248 00:15:33,900 --> 00:15:36,067 Just thinking Kurt Cobain, Kurt Cobain, Kurt Cobain. 249 00:15:36,067 --> 00:15:38,067 [Voiceover] Kurt Cobain, Kurt Cobain, Kurt Cobain, 250 00:15:38,067 --> 00:15:39,833 Kurt Cobain, Kurt Cobain. 251 00:15:39,833 --> 00:15:44,833 (Rock music) 252 00:16:10,167 --> 00:16:15,133 (Rock music) 253 00:16:25,833 --> 00:16:27,433 Growing up in Aberdeen, 254 00:16:29,067 --> 00:16:31,400 Basically not a whole lot to do. 255 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:33,567 Nine months out of the year is very dreary, 256 00:16:33,567 --> 00:16:35,500 Very overcast, lotsa rain. 257 00:16:35,500 --> 00:16:39,567 It's kinda hard living in this area and not being depressed. 258 00:16:39,567 --> 00:16:41,700 Employment opportunities in Aberdeen, 259 00:16:41,700 --> 00:16:45,367 There's not a whole lot. 260 00:16:45,367 --> 00:16:48,300 For the most part, we were lower-middle class. 261 00:16:48,300 --> 00:16:50,767 I don't think we would be considered poor, 262 00:16:50,767 --> 00:16:52,400 We certainly didn't go hungry. 263 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:54,133 The first two weeks of the month, everybody gets 264 00:16:54,133 --> 00:16:56,533 Their welfare check, the bars are packed. 265 00:16:56,533 --> 00:16:58,833 The last two weeks of the month, the bars are empty 266 00:16:58,833 --> 00:17:02,900 And that's pretty much the state of living. (Laughing) 267 00:17:02,900 --> 00:17:04,800 Kurt used to live across the street, 268 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:06,967 And his mother and him, they'd sit out there and argue 269 00:17:06,967 --> 00:17:11,467 For a half hour or 45 minutes, and the wife and I slept up 270 00:17:11,467 --> 00:17:15,200 In the upstairs bedroom, so we used to hear it. (Laughing) 271 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:19,067 I knew Kurt Cobain from the high school. 272 00:17:19,067 --> 00:17:22,800 He ran around with my two oldest sons. 273 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:25,500 The couch I'm sitting on now is the couch 274 00:17:25,500 --> 00:17:27,567 That Kurt slept on. 275 00:17:27,567 --> 00:17:32,567 He stayed for a few days, and then a few days more, 276 00:17:32,967 --> 00:17:37,967 And it just sorta stretched out to be about a year. 277 00:17:38,833 --> 00:17:42,700 It's a depressing atmosphere, but I also think 278 00:17:42,700 --> 00:17:45,333 At the same time, that's why we have so many bands 279 00:17:45,333 --> 00:17:47,100 From all over Washington State. 280 00:17:47,100 --> 00:17:48,333 There was nothing to do. 281 00:17:48,333 --> 00:17:52,067 It rained constantly, so what you had to do was 282 00:17:52,067 --> 00:17:53,333 You had to improvise. 283 00:17:53,333 --> 00:17:55,300 People tended to pick up instruments and play, 284 00:17:55,300 --> 00:17:57,067 And I think that just affected the music 285 00:17:57,067 --> 00:17:58,767 For this whole region in general. 286 00:17:58,767 --> 00:18:02,100 In our neighborhood, we lived a block away 287 00:18:02,100 --> 00:18:05,433 From the group that became the Melvins. 288 00:18:05,433 --> 00:18:09,367 Metal Church lived in the house next door. 289 00:18:09,367 --> 00:18:12,400 We had examples of people who made it. 290 00:18:12,400 --> 00:18:14,667 I used to see him with his drum sticks beat 291 00:18:14,667 --> 00:18:18,133 On the stop signs, on the fences, and his dad had 292 00:18:18,133 --> 00:18:21,933 A old Ford pickup, he used to beat on that. (Laughing) 293 00:18:21,933 --> 00:18:25,067 When he first saw the Melvins live for the first time, 294 00:18:25,067 --> 00:18:27,300 He just knew that that was what he wanted to do. 295 00:18:27,300 --> 00:18:29,667 The day that changed his life. 296 00:18:29,667 --> 00:18:32,967 Before Nirvana, we were called Skid Row, 297 00:18:32,967 --> 00:18:35,133 And then we went from Skid Row and we played live 298 00:18:35,133 --> 00:18:37,700 On the radio, a midnight show on Chaos. 299 00:18:37,700 --> 00:18:40,433 The very next day, I showed up at Kurt's 300 00:18:40,433 --> 00:18:43,433 And Kurt had his easel and he was paintin' 301 00:18:43,433 --> 00:18:46,333 This picture, and I looked at it and I go, 302 00:18:46,333 --> 00:18:47,333 "What the hell?" 303 00:18:47,333 --> 00:18:50,267 It was a painting of a giant pen 304 00:18:50,267 --> 00:18:52,200 With its cap all chewed up. 305 00:18:53,067 --> 00:18:55,167 From that day on, we were called Pencap Chew. 306 00:18:55,167 --> 00:18:56,700 We did some shows as Pencap Chew, 307 00:18:56,700 --> 00:19:00,833 And Kurt tired of that, so we're Ted Ed Fred. 308 00:19:00,833 --> 00:19:03,667 They don't like that no more, so we're gonna be Bliss. 309 00:19:04,500 --> 00:19:06,167 The fourth name was Bliss, 310 00:19:06,167 --> 00:19:08,900 And then the fifth name was Nirvana. 311 00:19:10,333 --> 00:19:12,933 I didn't see him as being particularly 312 00:19:12,933 --> 00:19:15,633 Different emotionally from any of us. 313 00:19:15,633 --> 00:19:17,567 I think people tended to read him wrong, 314 00:19:17,567 --> 00:19:19,500 Just because he was a quiet person. 315 00:19:19,500 --> 00:19:22,200 I don't see Kurt as being depressed at all, 316 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:24,067 I see him as being optimistic. 317 00:19:24,067 --> 00:19:26,367 He gave me a lotta hope, 318 00:19:26,367 --> 00:19:28,200 To hopefully, some day, get outta this area 319 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:30,067 With my music. 320 00:19:30,067 --> 00:19:33,233 Nirvana, Mudhoney and the Melvins was doing something. 321 00:19:33,233 --> 00:19:34,667 It was proactive. 322 00:19:34,667 --> 00:19:38,667 To me, that takes courage, and he had that courage, 323 00:19:38,667 --> 00:19:41,533 And that was the big difference. 324 00:19:41,533 --> 00:19:45,067 He had so much talent and tremendous amount 325 00:19:45,067 --> 00:19:48,500 Of creativity to give, so it's unlimited, 326 00:19:48,500 --> 00:19:50,133 What he could've done. 327 00:19:50,533 --> 00:19:53,567 It would be nice to, eventually, start playing 328 00:19:53,567 --> 00:19:57,267 Acoustic guitars and be thought of as a singer 329 00:19:57,267 --> 00:20:00,600 And a songwriter rather than a grunge rocker. 330 00:20:01,167 --> 00:20:03,067 Because then I might be able to take advantage of that 331 00:20:03,067 --> 00:20:05,600 When I'm older and sit down on a chair 332 00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:09,567 And play acoustic guitar like Johnny Cash or something, 333 00:20:10,467 --> 00:20:13,767 And it won't be a big joke, but who knows? 334 00:20:15,100 --> 00:20:17,200 My last real memory of Kurt 335 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,167 And it's not a good thing for me, but I was on my way 336 00:20:21,167 --> 00:20:22,800 To work and I had to get gas. 337 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:24,633 I stopped in at one of my former employers 338 00:20:24,633 --> 00:20:27,667 And I was gettin' gas for my car, and they actually 339 00:20:27,667 --> 00:20:29,333 Had the radio playing. 340 00:20:31,967 --> 00:20:33,700 They overheard it on the radio and stuff, 341 00:20:33,700 --> 00:20:36,400 Standing, paying for my gas, and it was like... 342 00:20:39,933 --> 00:20:41,867 I can't forget that day. 343 00:20:48,700 --> 00:20:53,700 (Eerie guitar music) 344 00:20:56,533 --> 00:20:57,533 [Courtney] I called the credit card company 345 00:20:57,533 --> 00:21:00,933 Like you said, and 346 00:21:02,667 --> 00:21:04,067 They told me he also bought two tickets 347 00:21:04,067 --> 00:21:05,333 On United Airlines. 348 00:21:05,867 --> 00:21:07,100 [Older man] Where to? 349 00:21:07,100 --> 00:21:09,600 They don't know, or they won't tell me. 350 00:21:10,933 --> 00:21:13,233 All they told me was how much he paid for 'em. 351 00:21:13,233 --> 00:21:15,300 So, I dunno. 352 00:21:19,267 --> 00:21:21,600 Maybe he's going to hang out with Michael again. 353 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:22,733 Michael. 354 00:21:22,733 --> 00:21:24,100 Stipe. 355 00:21:25,733 --> 00:21:27,867 Lead singer of R.E.M? 356 00:21:30,667 --> 00:21:35,500 Anyway, I figure he flies up, gets his guitar 357 00:21:35,500 --> 00:21:37,500 From Seattle and then he flies down to Atlanta, 358 00:21:37,500 --> 00:21:38,700 But he has two tickets. 359 00:21:38,700 --> 00:21:41,067 Did he buy a ticket for someone else? 360 00:21:41,667 --> 00:21:46,467 (Crying) 361 00:21:46,467 --> 00:21:49,133 I think Kurt wants a divorce. 362 00:21:49,133 --> 00:21:50,800 Why would you say that? 363 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:55,467 He left me a note in Rome, he said he's leaving me. 364 00:21:56,100 --> 00:21:58,433 The subject of divorce came up almost every time 365 00:21:58,433 --> 00:22:00,100 We talked after that. 366 00:22:00,100 --> 00:22:02,633 Whenever Courtney referred to divorce, 367 00:22:02,633 --> 00:22:04,567 She would usually say something like... 368 00:22:09,900 --> 00:22:11,367 The only way that a divorce is gonna happen is 369 00:22:11,367 --> 00:22:13,800 If I bust him for infidelity. 370 00:22:14,500 --> 00:22:15,300 Has he been unfaithful? 371 00:22:15,300 --> 00:22:18,533 Yes! Yes, I think so. 372 00:22:18,533 --> 00:22:21,333 Courtney, on several occasions, mentioned that she thought 373 00:22:21,333 --> 00:22:24,533 Kurt might be having an affair with Kristen Pfaff, 374 00:22:24,533 --> 00:22:25,967 Her bass player. 375 00:22:25,967 --> 00:22:28,967 She was very jealous, and she also felt like he might 376 00:22:28,967 --> 00:22:31,067 Be having an affair with Caitlin. 377 00:22:31,067 --> 00:22:32,333 His drug dealer. 378 00:22:32,333 --> 00:22:34,933 If Kurt's in Seattle, he's with her. 379 00:22:34,933 --> 00:22:37,233 She seemed to be very jealous of anybody 380 00:22:37,233 --> 00:22:40,200 That got near Kurt, and wanted to know every little move 381 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,133 That he made. 382 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:50,967 So I planted a story in the news yesterday, 383 00:22:50,967 --> 00:22:55,433 Saying that I had OD'ed and that I was in the hospital, 384 00:22:55,433 --> 00:22:58,500 Thinking that Kurt would get scared and call me. 385 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:00,867 I dunno, it's like... 386 00:23:01,667 --> 00:23:04,933 I've got this record coming out in a week, 387 00:23:05,667 --> 00:23:10,667 And so I know the value of this, but I didn't think about it 388 00:23:11,167 --> 00:23:12,467 When it first happened, but 389 00:23:15,867 --> 00:23:18,800 (Laughing) 390 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,267 Anyway, what do I tell this guy from the Associated Press? 391 00:23:22,267 --> 00:23:26,067 Should I call and confirm it, and so the story goes out, 392 00:23:26,067 --> 00:23:27,467 And say I was there? 393 00:23:27,467 --> 00:23:29,467 I tell you what, and this is just my gut instinct 394 00:23:29,467 --> 00:23:30,667 Yeah. 395 00:23:51,700 --> 00:23:53,333 That way there's no drugs involved 396 00:23:53,333 --> 00:23:55,067 And the sympathy goes to me. 397 00:23:58,700 --> 00:24:01,933 (Laughing) The press always perceives me as just completely 398 00:24:01,933 --> 00:24:06,067 Tragic and fucked up anyway, so I don't know. 399 00:24:14,733 --> 00:24:18,433 Thank you very much, that's a lot of information, 400 00:24:18,767 --> 00:24:20,500 And we'll go do our job. 401 00:24:36,233 --> 00:24:40,233 We were already convinced that Tom was sincere, 402 00:24:40,233 --> 00:24:41,633 That he believed what he was saying. 403 00:24:41,633 --> 00:24:43,233 He certainly wasn't lying. 404 00:24:43,233 --> 00:24:45,900 He brought us into this office with a safe, 405 00:24:45,900 --> 00:24:49,333 Opened the safe, and there was this trove of cassette tapes, 406 00:24:49,333 --> 00:24:51,767 Just hours and hours of tapes. 407 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,100 And then he starts playing us the tapes. 408 00:24:56,067 --> 00:24:59,700 And the facts were there. 409 00:25:11,567 --> 00:25:14,733 She's just, coming across as very controlling 410 00:25:14,733 --> 00:25:16,633 And very angry. 411 00:25:33,533 --> 00:25:36,567 Something was going on that was outta the ordinary, 412 00:25:36,567 --> 00:25:40,333 And there was more to this than what I was being told. 413 00:25:40,333 --> 00:25:41,833 [Courtney] I called Seattle Police, 414 00:25:42,633 --> 00:25:44,733 Filed a missing person's report. 415 00:25:44,733 --> 00:25:46,467 [Tom] Did they ask when you were comin' back? 416 00:25:46,467 --> 00:25:49,300 She filed it in the name of Wendy O'Connor, 417 00:25:49,300 --> 00:25:51,067 Kurt Cobain's mother. 418 00:25:57,167 --> 00:25:58,933 [Courtney] If I filed it under my own name. 419 00:25:58,933 --> 00:26:01,100 So all the media that went out after that 420 00:26:01,100 --> 00:26:03,767 That said Kurt's mother filed a missing person's report 421 00:26:03,767 --> 00:26:05,200 Was totally false. 422 00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:07,667 On April 4th, Kurt Cobain's mother, Wendy O'Connor, 423 00:26:07,667 --> 00:26:10,133 Filed a missing person's report on her son 424 00:26:10,133 --> 00:26:12,067 Because he reportedly fled a 425 00:26:12,067 --> 00:26:13,767 Quote end quote, "facility." 426 00:26:13,767 --> 00:26:16,400 She did not clarify whether that was a drug treatment center 427 00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:19,067 Or not, but that's what people are speculating. 428 00:26:19,067 --> 00:26:21,433 She was worried about Kurt because he had a shotgun 429 00:26:21,433 --> 00:26:22,667 In his possession. 430 00:26:22,667 --> 00:26:25,733 She considered him suicidal. 431 00:26:25,733 --> 00:26:27,767 [Courtney] That should get things going, right? 432 00:26:28,133 --> 00:26:29,100 [Tom] Right. 433 00:26:29,333 --> 00:26:30,633 [Courtney] What about Caitlin? 434 00:26:30,633 --> 00:26:32,467 I know that they're together. 435 00:26:32,467 --> 00:26:33,833 [Tom] I've got someone watching her apartment. 436 00:26:33,833 --> 00:26:35,233 He hasn't showed up. 437 00:26:35,233 --> 00:26:36,700 I wanna put someone on your house too, 438 00:26:36,700 --> 00:26:39,600 Because sooner or later he's gonna come home. 439 00:26:40,167 --> 00:26:42,767 [Courtney] But if Kurt's still in Seattle, 440 00:26:42,767 --> 00:26:47,100 He's hiding out, he's not gonna be at the house. 441 00:26:48,567 --> 00:26:52,667 He likes to stay in hotels, fancy hotels downtown. 442 00:26:56,167 --> 00:26:58,733 He uses the name Simon Richie. 443 00:26:59,867 --> 00:27:02,633 Mm, mm, or Bill Bailey. 444 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:04,833 You should check that out. 445 00:27:06,567 --> 00:27:08,233 The next day, on Monday, when we hadn't had 446 00:27:08,233 --> 00:27:12,700 Any success with the really nice hotels in Seattle, 447 00:27:12,700 --> 00:27:16,667 We began calling some of the other smaller motels, 448 00:27:16,667 --> 00:27:20,233 And we located a motel, and there was a 449 00:27:20,233 --> 00:27:22,600 Bill Bailey registered there. 450 00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:23,800 I wanna send one of our guys over there 451 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:25,300 To see if it's Kurt. 452 00:27:25,300 --> 00:27:26,267 [Courtney] No no no no no no, I don't want Kurt to know 453 00:27:26,267 --> 00:27:27,700 That I'm looking for him. 454 00:27:27,700 --> 00:27:29,067 Send somebody over there, 455 00:27:29,067 --> 00:27:31,667 Just have them watch the hotel, okay? 456 00:27:32,300 --> 00:27:33,867 Okay. 457 00:27:36,367 --> 00:27:38,867 I dunno, 15 or 20 minutes went by. 458 00:27:38,867 --> 00:27:41,133 What do you mean you called the hotel? 459 00:27:41,133 --> 00:27:43,200 I thought that you said that you didn't want Kurt to... 460 00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:45,067 [Courtney] No! I, Tom... 461 00:27:45,067 --> 00:27:49,067 Okay, listen, if he's not there, 462 00:27:49,067 --> 00:27:50,433 Then I think we need to set up a team 463 00:27:50,433 --> 00:27:51,733 At the Lake Washington house. 464 00:27:51,733 --> 00:27:53,200 It's a waste of time, Tom. 465 00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:55,067 You know what, he's not gonna be there. 466 00:27:55,067 --> 00:27:57,067 Is there a reason that you don't want surveillance 467 00:27:57,067 --> 00:27:58,067 On your house? 468 00:27:58,067 --> 00:28:00,300 Yes, because we don't need it. 469 00:28:00,300 --> 00:28:03,200 Cali's there, he'll tell me if Kurt shows up. 470 00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:08,200 (Ominous music) 471 00:28:17,633 --> 00:28:19,900 [Tom] Earlier in the day in a conversation, 472 00:28:19,900 --> 00:28:21,867 Courtney told me she didn't trust Cali, 473 00:28:21,867 --> 00:28:24,333 And she said he's one of the best liars she's ever met. 474 00:28:24,333 --> 00:28:25,933 But now, all of a sudden, she tells me 475 00:28:25,933 --> 00:28:27,067 He won't tell anybody. 476 00:28:27,067 --> 00:28:32,067 (Ominous music) 477 00:28:36,567 --> 00:28:37,500 [Tom] I'm not as effective for you here 478 00:28:37,500 --> 00:28:38,867 As I would be up there. 479 00:28:38,867 --> 00:28:41,400 I'd like to move the entire search up to Seattle. 480 00:28:42,467 --> 00:28:44,533 I know I got guys on the ground there, local guys, 481 00:28:44,533 --> 00:28:48,133 And if I were there I could move 'em along a little. 482 00:28:48,700 --> 00:28:50,967 That's fine, you can go. 483 00:28:51,467 --> 00:28:54,167 That's great, that's great. 484 00:28:54,167 --> 00:28:55,500 [Woman] Why don't you go up there, Courtney? 485 00:28:55,500 --> 00:28:57,500 [Courtney] Because I can't! 486 00:28:57,500 --> 00:29:00,067 I have business to take care of here. 487 00:29:01,100 --> 00:29:02,400 Look, I'd appreciate it if you didn't tell anyone 488 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:03,900 I was traveling up there. 489 00:29:03,900 --> 00:29:06,200 If anyone knows, they might tell Kurt, 490 00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:08,400 And then he could flee. 491 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,333 [Courtney] Absolutely, I think it's a really good idea. 492 00:29:12,067 --> 00:29:14,733 Okay, I'm gonna get goin'. 493 00:29:19,333 --> 00:29:22,467 [Courtney] Save the American icon, Tom. 494 00:29:22,467 --> 00:29:27,467 (Ominous music) 495 00:29:29,467 --> 00:29:34,467 (Rock music) 496 00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:53,300 As I was getting ready to fly to Seattle, 497 00:29:53,300 --> 00:29:55,800 Courtney told me about Dylan Carlson. 498 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,067 Dylan knew all the hangouts, he knew the house 499 00:29:58,067 --> 00:29:59,633 Really well. 500 00:29:59,633 --> 00:30:02,200 Kurt's best friend was Dylan Carlson. 501 00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,167 So what are you thinkin', is he suicidal? 502 00:30:05,167 --> 00:30:06,967 No, not at all. 503 00:30:07,933 --> 00:30:09,733 He's been under a lotta pressure but he's been handling 504 00:30:09,733 --> 00:30:11,567 Things pretty good. 505 00:30:11,567 --> 00:30:12,933 I know he and Courtney have been having 506 00:30:12,933 --> 00:30:15,533 A lotta troubles lately, but... 507 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,467 I don't know why Kurt married her. 508 00:30:19,467 --> 00:30:21,433 They don't get along, they don't agree about anything, 509 00:30:21,433 --> 00:30:24,267 They're always fighting, that type of thing. 510 00:30:24,267 --> 00:30:27,200 This thing in Rome, did anybody say 511 00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,733 That that may have been him tryin' to kill himself? 512 00:30:29,733 --> 00:30:32,200 No, it was an accident. 513 00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:33,800 Everybody knows that. 514 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:35,900 I asked him several times about whether Kurt was 515 00:30:35,900 --> 00:30:39,600 Suicidal or not, and it was almost a joke to him. 516 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:41,433 It was like, "No, of course not." 517 00:30:41,433 --> 00:30:45,333 'Cause I'm thinkin' if he was as suicidal 518 00:30:45,333 --> 00:30:47,867 As she says he is, why would she let him buy a shotgun? 519 00:30:47,867 --> 00:30:49,967 He's not suicidal. 520 00:30:49,967 --> 00:30:52,400 We bought that shotgun the day he went to rehab, 521 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:54,767 Been a burglary at the house recently. 522 00:30:54,767 --> 00:30:57,133 The police had just confiscated his other gun, 523 00:30:57,133 --> 00:30:59,433 So I registered it in my name. 524 00:31:01,833 --> 00:31:04,100 Trust me, if he was suicidal, I would never let him 525 00:31:04,100 --> 00:31:05,933 Get a shotgun. 526 00:31:10,867 --> 00:31:13,067 Singer Courtney Love says Cobain had first written 527 00:31:13,067 --> 00:31:15,567 A suicide note to her which said, in part, 528 00:31:15,567 --> 00:31:19,067 "It's not fun for me anymore, I can't live this life." 529 00:31:19,067 --> 00:31:21,167 There was a mythology that, "Oh yeah", 530 00:31:21,167 --> 00:31:22,867 "Everybody knew he was suicidal," 531 00:31:22,867 --> 00:31:25,133 "That was just obvious," 532 00:31:25,133 --> 00:31:27,933 So it was no big surprise when he finally killed himself. 533 00:31:27,933 --> 00:31:30,100 And then you go to those closest to him, 534 00:31:30,100 --> 00:31:32,067 The people that knew him best, 535 00:31:32,067 --> 00:31:34,800 And none of them believed he was suicidal. 536 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:38,067 I've never heard Kurt talk about suicide or anything, 537 00:31:38,067 --> 00:31:39,833 He always seemed happy around me. 538 00:31:39,833 --> 00:31:42,733 Quiet, shy, but definitely happy. 539 00:31:42,733 --> 00:31:45,600 Never hinted to me that he was depressed. 540 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,533 His music and his lyrics portrayed a darker side 541 00:31:49,533 --> 00:31:53,500 To some of his emotions, but I think that was glorified. 542 00:31:53,500 --> 00:31:55,767 People start to analyze the lyrics and look at some 543 00:31:55,767 --> 00:31:57,633 Of the things that he wrote and say, 544 00:31:57,633 --> 00:31:59,567 "Of course, look at what he wrote here." 545 00:31:59,567 --> 00:32:02,233 "Obviously he's talking about suicide." 546 00:32:02,233 --> 00:32:05,333 I'm tired of people thinking, trying to put 547 00:32:05,333 --> 00:32:07,633 Too much meaning into my lyrics. 548 00:32:07,633 --> 00:32:09,067 A lotta times when I write lyrics, which is 549 00:32:09,067 --> 00:32:12,333 At the last second 'cause I'm really lazy. 550 00:32:12,333 --> 00:32:14,267 And then I find myself having to come up 551 00:32:14,267 --> 00:32:16,233 With explanations for it. 552 00:32:16,700 --> 00:32:20,100 There may be one or two lines in a song here and there, 553 00:32:20,100 --> 00:32:23,433 But I swear to God, brother, it's really not 554 00:32:23,433 --> 00:32:25,567 As much as it seems. 555 00:32:25,567 --> 00:32:27,767 The pain in his stomach, this was a big thing 556 00:32:27,767 --> 00:32:30,633 This stomach pain that he'd been suffering for years 557 00:32:30,633 --> 00:32:33,633 Was so severe that it made him wanna kill himself. 558 00:32:33,633 --> 00:32:35,800 He did talk like that, there's no question, 559 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:39,933 And once that was diagnosed, it was treated, 560 00:32:39,933 --> 00:32:41,100 And the pain went away. 561 00:32:41,100 --> 00:32:42,967 [Voiceover] How's your stomach? 562 00:32:42,967 --> 00:32:44,067 Have you found anything to... 563 00:32:44,067 --> 00:32:47,067 (Sighing) It's gone. 564 00:32:47,067 --> 00:32:48,500 - [Voiceover] Yeah? - Yeah. 565 00:32:48,500 --> 00:32:51,833 I finally have been prescribed the right stomach medicine 566 00:32:51,833 --> 00:32:56,833 After six years of being in constant pain, finally. 567 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,800 I haven't had a stomach problem for over a year now. 568 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:04,967 The stomach pain and the outlook and his disposition 569 00:33:04,967 --> 00:33:07,067 Seem to be very closely linked. 570 00:33:07,067 --> 00:33:08,733 He had given an interview to Rolling Stone, 571 00:33:08,733 --> 00:33:11,267 Where he said he was happier than he'd ever been. 572 00:33:11,267 --> 00:33:12,067 [Voiceover] Is this your idea? 573 00:33:12,067 --> 00:33:13,400 (Kurt burping) 574 00:33:14,633 --> 00:33:18,533 When you hear Courtney spinning this whole 575 00:33:18,533 --> 00:33:23,533 Elaborate timeline about how he tried to commit suicide 576 00:33:23,533 --> 00:33:25,900 Before and he was talking about suicide 577 00:33:25,900 --> 00:33:29,600 To everybody he knew, that just seems to be fiction. 578 00:33:30,333 --> 00:33:32,567 Rather chillingly, Love says that three of Cobain's 579 00:33:32,567 --> 00:33:34,867 Uncles had also committed suicide. 580 00:33:34,867 --> 00:33:37,267 She calls it the Cobain curse. 581 00:33:37,267 --> 00:33:41,100 As far as the suicide history in the Cobain family, 582 00:33:41,100 --> 00:33:43,767 Leland Cobain's father, he was a Monte Santo 583 00:33:43,767 --> 00:33:47,733 Police officer, and he went into a bar one day 584 00:33:47,733 --> 00:33:48,900 And he sat at a bar stool. 585 00:33:48,900 --> 00:33:50,767 This was back in 1938. 586 00:33:50,767 --> 00:33:53,433 His gun somehow dislodged from its holster, 587 00:33:53,433 --> 00:33:56,767 Hit the ground, and according to the report, 588 00:33:56,767 --> 00:33:59,067 He looked around in the bar and asked if everybody 589 00:33:59,067 --> 00:34:00,933 Was okay, and then immediately collapsed. 590 00:34:00,933 --> 00:34:03,100 He just fell dead. 591 00:34:03,767 --> 00:34:06,700 From what Leland has told me about his brother, 592 00:34:06,700 --> 00:34:11,700 His brother was drinking and he fell down a staircase 593 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:14,067 And died from complications of that. 594 00:34:14,067 --> 00:34:15,233 Neither Kurt's great-grandpa 595 00:34:15,233 --> 00:34:18,167 Or his great-uncle were suicides. 596 00:34:18,933 --> 00:34:20,667 One of the important elements in the case, 597 00:34:20,667 --> 00:34:24,067 And in convincing the world that it was suicide 598 00:34:24,067 --> 00:34:27,533 Was the so-called "Rome suicide attempt." 599 00:34:27,533 --> 00:34:30,167 (Drumming) 600 00:34:30,167 --> 00:34:31,733 Nirvana front-man Kurt Cobain, 601 00:34:31,733 --> 00:34:33,567 Who slipped into a coma and was hospitalized 602 00:34:33,567 --> 00:34:36,100 In Rome, Italy, at about 6AM this morning, was in a state 603 00:34:36,100 --> 00:34:38,800 Of what his management calls "complete collapse." 604 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:40,400 His condition was apparently aggravated 605 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:42,067 When he consumed champagne on top of a 606 00:34:42,067 --> 00:34:44,600 Prescription painkiller called Rohypnol. 607 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:47,867 At the time, the word suicide was never used 608 00:34:47,867 --> 00:34:50,133 By the media, by Courtney, by Kurt. 609 00:34:50,133 --> 00:34:53,367 It was portrayed as an accidental drug overdose. 610 00:34:53,367 --> 00:34:55,467 [Voiceover] He recovered from the coma, and his publicists 611 00:34:55,467 --> 00:34:58,333 Said the incident was an accident, not a suicide attempt. 612 00:34:58,333 --> 00:35:02,100 As soon as Kurt died, first interviews that Courtney gave 613 00:35:02,100 --> 00:35:04,867 She started talking about previous suicide attempts, 614 00:35:04,867 --> 00:35:06,833 Rome was a suicide attempt. 615 00:35:06,833 --> 00:35:08,967 Courtney started telling people 616 00:35:08,967 --> 00:35:12,067 That Kurt had swallowed 60 pills. 617 00:35:13,067 --> 00:35:14,700 You swallow 60 pills, that's not an accident. 618 00:35:14,700 --> 00:35:16,400 That's a suicide attempt. 619 00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:20,133 So we decided to contact the doctor that treated Kurt 620 00:35:20,133 --> 00:35:25,133 In Rome, Doctor Galletta, and he categorically denied 621 00:35:25,367 --> 00:35:28,533 That there were 60 pills in his stomach 622 00:35:28,533 --> 00:35:31,067 And that it was a suicide attempt. 623 00:35:31,067 --> 00:35:34,700 At the time, Kurt and Courtney both said it was 624 00:35:34,700 --> 00:35:37,433 An accident, and the doctor confirmed that. 625 00:35:37,433 --> 00:35:40,233 So there's just no evidence that he had ever tried 626 00:35:40,233 --> 00:35:41,833 To kill himself before. 627 00:35:41,833 --> 00:35:44,767 No anecdotal evidence, nobody else close to Kurt 628 00:35:44,767 --> 00:35:47,833 Ever said that he tried to commit suicide, 629 00:35:47,833 --> 00:35:50,767 But the world just took Courtney's word for it. 630 00:36:26,733 --> 00:36:31,733 (Sad guitar music) 631 00:36:33,433 --> 00:36:35,767 While I was in Seattle with Dylan and we were driving 632 00:36:35,767 --> 00:36:38,100 Around, I mentioned to him that Courtney said 633 00:36:38,100 --> 00:36:41,067 That Kurt only stays in the best hotels, 634 00:36:41,067 --> 00:36:43,700 And he was almost incredulous. 635 00:36:43,700 --> 00:36:45,767 He practically laughed and he said, 636 00:36:45,767 --> 00:36:47,233 "That's ridiculous!" 637 00:36:47,233 --> 00:36:51,200 "He hates fancy hotels, he stays in really cheap places," 638 00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:53,700 "Mostly along the Aurora strip." 639 00:36:53,700 --> 00:36:55,800 Have you seen him or not? 640 00:36:56,633 --> 00:36:57,933 Okay, come on. 641 00:36:57,933 --> 00:37:02,933 (Eerie music) 642 00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:07,700 [Dylan] I'm gonna call Courtney and check in. 643 00:37:07,700 --> 00:37:09,333 I dunno what's goin' on. 644 00:37:09,333 --> 00:37:12,500 Dylan told me that when they did stay at those motels, 645 00:37:12,500 --> 00:37:14,667 They usually stayed for two or three weeks, 646 00:37:14,667 --> 00:37:18,067 Basically living off of Coca Cola and potato chips 647 00:37:18,067 --> 00:37:20,067 And doing their heroin. 648 00:37:27,100 --> 00:37:29,100 Courtney always wanted to go through Dylan, 649 00:37:29,100 --> 00:37:31,500 She wanted to talk to Dylan on the phone 650 00:37:31,500 --> 00:37:34,467 And have Dylan give me the instructions. 651 00:37:34,467 --> 00:37:37,433 Courtney's had some trouble, she was in the hospital 652 00:37:37,433 --> 00:37:39,367 And she got arrested. 653 00:37:39,367 --> 00:37:40,833 What? 654 00:37:40,833 --> 00:37:43,800 She said that it was all a big mistake and she's fine. 655 00:37:44,267 --> 00:37:45,700 She wants us to go back to the house and look 656 00:37:45,700 --> 00:37:47,533 For the shotgun again. 657 00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:49,867 She thinks it might be in the hidden compartment 658 00:37:49,867 --> 00:37:51,567 Of the bedroom closet. 659 00:37:51,567 --> 00:37:53,333 Hidden compartment? 660 00:37:53,333 --> 00:37:55,500 She hadn't mentioned that to us before, 661 00:37:55,500 --> 00:37:57,833 But she said, "That's where Kurt keeps the shotgun", 662 00:37:57,833 --> 00:38:00,300 "So if it's there, that's where it's gonna be." 663 00:38:01,133 --> 00:38:02,633 [Tom] Let's go. 664 00:38:03,733 --> 00:38:08,733 (Ominous music) 665 00:38:19,900 --> 00:38:21,667 Remember this from last night? 666 00:38:21,667 --> 00:38:23,067 [Dylan] No. 667 00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,367 The note that was apparently written by Cali 668 00:38:26,367 --> 00:38:27,800 Didn't make sense. 669 00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,767 "Kurt, I can't believe you managed to be in this house" 670 00:38:31,767 --> 00:38:33,500 "Without me noticing." 671 00:38:33,500 --> 00:38:36,567 "You're a fucking asshole for not calling Courtney" 672 00:38:36,567 --> 00:38:39,633 "And at least letting her know that you're okay." 673 00:38:39,633 --> 00:38:42,400 "She's in a lot of pain, Kurt, and this morning" 674 00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,433 "She had another accident, and now she's" 675 00:38:44,433 --> 00:38:46,567 "In the hospital again." 676 00:38:47,267 --> 00:38:49,400 We looked in that little hidden compartment. 677 00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:51,367 There was no shotgun there. 678 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,300 "She's your wife, she loves you," 679 00:38:55,300 --> 00:38:57,367 "And you have a child together." 680 00:38:57,367 --> 00:39:00,500 "Get it together to at least tell her you're okay," 681 00:39:00,500 --> 00:39:02,400 "Or she is going to die." 682 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:04,167 "It's not fair, man." 683 00:39:04,167 --> 00:39:05,733 "Do something now." 684 00:39:05,733 --> 00:39:10,733 (Eerie music) 685 00:39:15,500 --> 00:39:17,600 Later when I talked to Rosemary Carroll about it 686 00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:19,467 And I told her I was suspicious of it, 687 00:39:19,467 --> 00:39:22,767 She jumped in right away, and she knows Cali real well, too. 688 00:39:51,833 --> 00:39:56,833 (Eerie music) 689 00:40:15,700 --> 00:40:17,967 Dylan and I headed out to the town of Carnation, 690 00:40:17,967 --> 00:40:19,700 Just outside of Seattle. 691 00:40:20,633 --> 00:40:22,733 Kurt and Courtney owned two cabins there, 692 00:40:22,733 --> 00:40:24,833 And we were curious to see if there had been any evidence 693 00:40:24,833 --> 00:40:27,000 Of Kurt being there. 694 00:40:28,067 --> 00:40:32,033 We got about halfway there when we stopped to get gas, 695 00:40:32,033 --> 00:40:34,200 And Dylan made another phone call. 696 00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:39,200 (Ominous music) 697 00:40:45,667 --> 00:40:47,600 [Voiceover] I got a phone call from our electrician, 698 00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:52,500 Gary Smith, and he was doing some security lighting. 699 00:40:52,500 --> 00:40:53,933 We had a house above. 700 00:40:53,933 --> 00:40:55,767 We just knew it was a rock star in Seattle, 701 00:40:55,767 --> 00:40:58,333 We weren't sure, didn't know who he was. 702 00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,733 He literally just stumbled across it. 703 00:41:05,767 --> 00:41:08,067 He looked through a doorway, a glass door, 704 00:41:08,067 --> 00:41:11,867 A locked door, and he saw a body. 705 00:41:15,900 --> 00:41:19,067 And he said, "I think he shot himself." 706 00:41:19,067 --> 00:41:21,633 I called a radio station, told 'em what happened. 707 00:41:21,633 --> 00:41:23,900 [Voiceover] So I answered the call and there's a guy 708 00:41:23,900 --> 00:41:26,533 On the end of the line, and he's goin', "I have got" 709 00:41:26,533 --> 00:41:28,800 "Some incredible news here." 710 00:41:29,733 --> 00:41:31,200 [Tom] Anything? 711 00:41:34,367 --> 00:41:36,533 A friend of mine said he just heard they found a body 712 00:41:36,533 --> 00:41:38,700 At Kurt's house. 713 00:41:38,700 --> 00:41:40,167 [Tom] What? 714 00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,533 [Voiceover] Rock group Nirvana is dead. 715 00:41:47,533 --> 00:41:49,200 An electrician discovered Cobain's body 716 00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:51,867 In the singer's Lake Washington home this morning. 717 00:41:51,867 --> 00:41:54,267 The electrician tells KOMO news that emergency crews 718 00:41:54,267 --> 00:41:56,800 Told him that the dead man is Kurt Cobain. 719 00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:58,267 [Tom] When I heard that the body was found 720 00:41:58,267 --> 00:42:00,967 In a room that was called the Greenhouse, I turned 721 00:42:00,967 --> 00:42:04,333 To Dylan and I said, "What's the Greenhouse?" 722 00:42:04,333 --> 00:42:06,400 And he said, "It's just a dirty little room" 723 00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:07,633 "Above the garage." 724 00:42:07,633 --> 00:42:09,767 They stored lumber or something in there. 725 00:42:09,767 --> 00:42:11,533 It sounded to me like this was just 726 00:42:11,533 --> 00:42:13,600 Some kinda broom closet or something. 727 00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:14,800 [Voiceover] So do you think he intentionally 728 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:17,067 Did not tell you to check that room out? 729 00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,700 [Tom] Again, I hope the listeners bear in mind 730 00:42:19,700 --> 00:42:21,933 We're having to skip over an awful lotta stuff... 731 00:42:21,933 --> 00:42:26,067 (Eerie music) 732 00:42:26,067 --> 00:42:28,067 I glanced down on the floor and I saw 733 00:42:28,067 --> 00:42:29,967 Something that looked like a mannequin. 734 00:42:31,500 --> 00:42:34,067 I can see blood in this ear, and long hair, 735 00:42:34,067 --> 00:42:37,633 And immediately got a little shaken. 736 00:42:42,133 --> 00:42:44,067 The French doors were locked. 737 00:42:45,667 --> 00:42:47,967 I was first in and right away could see 738 00:42:47,967 --> 00:42:50,200 That it was a fatality. 739 00:42:53,100 --> 00:42:55,133 The shotgun lay in his lap, a significant pool of blood 740 00:42:55,133 --> 00:42:56,767 By his head. 741 00:42:56,767 --> 00:42:58,067 There was nothing we could do for him, 742 00:42:58,067 --> 00:43:00,067 So we didn't touch the body. 743 00:43:01,133 --> 00:43:04,500 We'll check for mail or somethin' with a name on it. 744 00:43:06,700 --> 00:43:08,500 The officer said, "Do you want the name?" 745 00:43:08,500 --> 00:43:10,400 Knowing I needed it for my log book. 746 00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:13,367 He said, "It's Cobain, Kurt Cobain." 747 00:43:14,167 --> 00:43:16,067 A couple of second delay and my head snappin' around, 748 00:43:16,067 --> 00:43:19,067 I said, "You mean the rock star?" 749 00:43:20,067 --> 00:43:22,600 [Voiceover] The developing story shocks the music world. 750 00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:25,767 A man found dead this morning is rock star Kurt Cobain. 751 00:43:25,767 --> 00:43:27,800 [Voiceover] Cobain's body was found about a... 752 00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:29,233 [Voiceover] Apparently it was a suicide... 753 00:43:29,233 --> 00:43:34,167 (Various voiceovers speaking simultaneously) 754 00:43:38,467 --> 00:43:39,767 [Voiceover] Was so severe that his body could only 755 00:43:39,767 --> 00:43:41,833 Be identified by fingerprints. 756 00:43:41,833 --> 00:43:43,400 [Voiceover] Police can't release the details found 757 00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:46,100 In Cobain's suicide note, but over the past couple 758 00:43:46,100 --> 00:43:49,133 Of years, Cobain has had some tough times. 759 00:43:49,133 --> 00:43:50,867 Cobain was 27. 760 00:43:50,867 --> 00:43:54,300 He joins a growing list of rock stars who burn bright 761 00:43:54,300 --> 00:43:56,633 Then burn out tragically. 762 00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,067 [Tom] When we arrived at the property 763 00:43:59,067 --> 00:44:01,500 It was broad daylight and the Greenhouse stuck out 764 00:44:01,500 --> 00:44:02,933 Like a sore thumb. 765 00:44:02,933 --> 00:44:05,067 You could see it from the street above the bushes, 766 00:44:05,067 --> 00:44:06,467 It was so tall. 767 00:44:06,467 --> 00:44:10,733 I just didn't understand why he didn't point that out to me. 768 00:44:13,133 --> 00:44:14,733 [Dylan] That's Entertainment Tonight. 769 00:44:15,333 --> 00:44:16,767 He's Rolling Stone. 770 00:44:16,767 --> 00:44:19,100 Dylan didn't like the press and he said Kurt didn't 771 00:44:19,100 --> 00:44:20,600 Like the press. 772 00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:22,867 [Dylan] Current Affairs; stay away from them. 773 00:44:23,433 --> 00:44:24,567 [Officer] Ho ho ho. 774 00:44:24,567 --> 00:44:25,567 [Tom] I'm Tom Grant, how are you? 775 00:44:25,567 --> 00:44:26,933 [Officer] Fine. 776 00:44:26,933 --> 00:44:29,333 [Tom] I was hired by Courtney Love to investigate 777 00:44:29,333 --> 00:44:30,867 The disappearance of her husband. 778 00:44:30,867 --> 00:44:33,600 I've got information I think would be helpful. 779 00:44:33,600 --> 00:44:36,567 Could I speak to the detective in charge? 780 00:44:37,200 --> 00:44:38,067 Wait here. 781 00:44:38,067 --> 00:44:43,067 (Eerie music) 782 00:44:50,567 --> 00:44:52,567 He said he's too busy to speak with you now. 783 00:44:52,567 --> 00:44:55,567 Call the station after 3PM; you can talk to him then. 784 00:44:55,567 --> 00:44:57,567 I was dumbfounded by that. 785 00:44:57,567 --> 00:45:00,933 If I were a police officer investigating the dead body 786 00:45:00,933 --> 00:45:03,867 And somebody told me there was somebody outside 787 00:45:03,867 --> 00:45:06,200 That had been in the house the night before, 788 00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:08,167 I'd tell them, "Hold him." 789 00:45:08,167 --> 00:45:10,867 "If they say they need to leave, handcuff 'em," 790 00:45:10,867 --> 00:45:13,667 "And keep 'em there until we get a chance to talk to 'em." 791 00:45:13,667 --> 00:45:15,300 You don't let somebody like that go, 792 00:45:15,300 --> 00:45:18,667 You don't take a chance until you've fully investigated 793 00:45:18,667 --> 00:45:23,467 A case and determined positively how this person died. 794 00:45:23,467 --> 00:45:24,900 The Seattle Police Department claimed 795 00:45:24,900 --> 00:45:28,100 They were investigating this as a possible homicide. 796 00:45:28,100 --> 00:45:30,500 If they were, they certainly wouldn't allow somebody 797 00:45:30,500 --> 00:45:33,200 To leave when they'd been in the house the night 798 00:45:33,200 --> 00:45:36,333 Before a dead body was found on the property. 799 00:45:36,867 --> 00:45:38,067 I'm Norm Stamper. 800 00:45:38,067 --> 00:45:40,733 I was a police officer for 34 years, 801 00:45:40,733 --> 00:45:45,733 And last six from 1994 to 2000 as Seattle's police chief. 802 00:45:45,900 --> 00:45:48,900 I wouldn't pretend that there aren't police officers 803 00:45:48,900 --> 00:45:53,100 Who are cynical and suspicious and skeptical. 804 00:45:53,100 --> 00:45:57,100 That was the case in the Kurt Cobain death. 805 00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:03,067 (Eerie music) 806 00:46:03,067 --> 00:46:04,800 John F. Kennedy, Martin Luther King, 807 00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,533 Elvis Presley, Marilyn Monroe. 808 00:46:07,533 --> 00:46:09,867 Over the past 50 years as a 809 00:46:09,867 --> 00:46:12,167 Medical-legal forensic pathology consultant, 810 00:46:12,167 --> 00:46:15,067 I've been involved in thousands of cases, 811 00:46:15,067 --> 00:46:17,833 About 18,000 autopsies, and I have reviewed, 812 00:46:17,833 --> 00:46:20,867 Signed off or supervised, and evaluated 813 00:46:20,867 --> 00:46:23,600 About 38,000 other autopsies. 814 00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:25,600 I have personally investigated, supervised, 815 00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:28,433 Consulted and researched on over 8,000 homicides. 816 00:46:28,433 --> 00:46:30,900 I wrote Practical Homicide Investigation because there was 817 00:46:30,900 --> 00:46:35,433 A need for a standard protocol to approach all death scenes. 818 00:46:35,433 --> 00:46:38,533 From the very beginning, everything that the detectives 819 00:46:38,533 --> 00:46:42,633 Encountered indicated to them that this was a suicide. 820 00:46:42,633 --> 00:46:47,600 The decision to rule the case by police the same day 821 00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:49,967 And to make a public pronouncement that this was 822 00:46:49,967 --> 00:46:54,333 A suicide is not the way good police agencies 823 00:46:54,333 --> 00:46:55,767 Would function today. 824 00:46:55,767 --> 00:46:57,267 As a homicide commander, 825 00:46:57,267 --> 00:46:59,067 I would not be making any proclamations 826 00:46:59,067 --> 00:47:02,300 That the case was a suicide without the evidence 827 00:47:02,300 --> 00:47:04,300 Having been processed: the victimology, 828 00:47:04,300 --> 00:47:06,833 The medical-legal process, toxicology. 829 00:47:06,833 --> 00:47:08,233 It's a death investigation. 830 00:47:08,233 --> 00:47:10,700 They knew nothing about the drug level, 831 00:47:10,700 --> 00:47:13,067 They knew nothing about fingerprints, 832 00:47:13,067 --> 00:47:15,067 They knew nothing about anything else at that time 833 00:47:15,067 --> 00:47:17,300 Except that they had found him with a shotgun. 834 00:47:17,300 --> 00:47:19,700 The reason we call things death investigations is 835 00:47:19,700 --> 00:47:21,933 That we don't wanna prematurely make them 836 00:47:21,933 --> 00:47:24,067 Homicides, suicides or accidents. 837 00:47:24,067 --> 00:47:25,700 It's a death investigation. 838 00:47:25,700 --> 00:47:29,600 Cases that involve prominent figures, 839 00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:34,367 These cases usually take more time because you know 840 00:47:34,367 --> 00:47:36,233 That there are gonna be more questions. 841 00:47:36,233 --> 00:47:37,833 People are gonna wanna know every single 842 00:47:37,833 --> 00:47:38,967 Thing about it. 843 00:47:38,967 --> 00:47:40,667 In the Philip Seymour Hoffman case, 844 00:47:40,667 --> 00:47:43,200 They found him with a needle in his arm. 845 00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:46,300 They found 50 bags of heroin right there 846 00:47:46,300 --> 00:47:48,367 In his apartment, and yet they did not make 847 00:47:48,367 --> 00:47:50,267 Any announcement beyond that. 848 00:47:50,267 --> 00:47:52,567 They knew that they should not be commenting. 849 00:47:52,567 --> 00:47:55,467 Official statements as to cause and manner of death 850 00:47:55,467 --> 00:47:58,867 Do not come from police or even homicide detectives. 851 00:47:58,867 --> 00:48:00,567 They do not. 852 00:48:03,167 --> 00:48:05,767 I've never believed that the police were involved 853 00:48:05,767 --> 00:48:09,167 From the beginning in any kind of a conspiracy 854 00:48:09,167 --> 00:48:11,633 Involving Kurt Cobain's death. 855 00:48:11,633 --> 00:48:14,333 I think they were set up by Courtney Love 856 00:48:14,333 --> 00:48:16,267 From that missing person's report, 857 00:48:16,267 --> 00:48:18,300 And everything that it said in it. 858 00:48:18,300 --> 00:48:22,367 If my officers heard or were made aware 859 00:48:22,367 --> 00:48:25,800 That Kurt Cobain had left rehab, had purchased 860 00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:29,567 A shotgun, was suicidal, that's of course going 861 00:48:29,567 --> 00:48:30,933 To affect them. 862 00:48:30,933 --> 00:48:33,900 They, what I call assumed the suicide position, 863 00:48:33,900 --> 00:48:36,067 Which to me means cut corners, not do this, 864 00:48:36,067 --> 00:48:39,067 Not do that, because it's a suicide, no problem. 865 00:48:39,067 --> 00:48:41,067 I have to admit, there's been a lot of inconsistencies 866 00:48:41,067 --> 00:48:42,333 In this case. 867 00:48:42,333 --> 00:48:43,867 Really? 868 00:48:43,867 --> 00:48:46,200 The reports that were coming out in the media said 869 00:48:46,200 --> 00:48:49,567 Kurt Cobain was barricaded inside the Greenhouse. 870 00:48:49,567 --> 00:48:51,400 Look at this photograph. 871 00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,433 Is that the lock you're talking about? 872 00:48:54,133 --> 00:48:55,500 I dunno where this picture's from, 873 00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:57,467 So I couldn't say. 874 00:48:57,467 --> 00:48:59,133 Well, it's from the Greenhouse. 875 00:48:59,133 --> 00:49:01,167 I've been over the place inside and out, 876 00:49:01,167 --> 00:49:03,700 And trust me, that is the only lock. 877 00:49:03,700 --> 00:49:05,067 If you say so. 878 00:49:05,900 --> 00:49:08,133 Presuming I'm telling you the truth, 879 00:49:08,133 --> 00:49:10,400 Why would you say that he locked himself in? 880 00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:13,833 Because the door was locked. 881 00:49:13,833 --> 00:49:15,067 Look at the picture. 882 00:49:15,067 --> 00:49:17,067 It's not a deadbolt, it's a twist lock. 883 00:49:17,067 --> 00:49:19,400 Anybody coulda twisted that lock and pulled the door shut 884 00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:20,667 Behind 'em when they left. 885 00:49:20,667 --> 00:49:22,367 Look, the lock doesn't matter. 886 00:49:22,367 --> 00:49:24,900 There was a stool wedged up against the door. 887 00:49:24,900 --> 00:49:26,233 Now how do you wedge a stool against a door 888 00:49:26,233 --> 00:49:27,700 After you've already left the room? 889 00:49:27,700 --> 00:49:30,500 [Tom] The police reports plainly states that the stool 890 00:49:30,500 --> 00:49:33,200 Was simply sitting in front of the two unlocked 891 00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,100 French doors at the other side of the room, 892 00:49:36,100 --> 00:49:39,067 But on one of the reports, it was added that the stool 893 00:49:39,067 --> 00:49:41,633 Was blocking the entrance. 894 00:49:43,133 --> 00:49:44,600 Someone reported that there was a stool 895 00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:45,633 Blocking the door. 896 00:49:45,633 --> 00:49:46,567 That wasn't the case. 897 00:49:46,567 --> 00:49:48,167 I dunno where that came from. 898 00:49:48,167 --> 00:49:49,733 If you could just show me the photographs 899 00:49:49,733 --> 00:49:52,200 Your officer took at the scene, we can put that issue 900 00:49:52,200 --> 00:49:53,433 To rest once and for all. 901 00:49:53,433 --> 00:49:55,600 Well the photographs haven't been developed, 902 00:49:55,600 --> 00:49:57,667 Probably never will be. 903 00:49:57,667 --> 00:50:01,367 We don't develop photographs on suicides. 904 00:50:02,233 --> 00:50:03,600 I have never heard of that. 905 00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:05,433 Every case I've been involved, with the crime scene 906 00:50:05,433 --> 00:50:06,733 Photographs were developed. 907 00:50:06,733 --> 00:50:08,533 Why not release 'em to other experts? 908 00:50:08,533 --> 00:50:10,000 I can't answer that question. 909 00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:13,567 It was something that the Seattle Police department did. 910 00:50:13,567 --> 00:50:16,267 In hindsight, they probably shouldn't have. 911 00:50:16,267 --> 00:50:17,867 But that's what they did. 912 00:50:17,867 --> 00:50:20,500 Nothing you've said convinces me this is anything 913 00:50:20,500 --> 00:50:22,333 But a suicide. 914 00:50:22,933 --> 00:50:25,467 Now do you got any other pearls for me? 915 00:50:27,100 --> 00:50:28,600 [Tom] Not at this time. 916 00:50:29,300 --> 00:50:32,367 Detective Cameron resigned when he learned 917 00:50:32,367 --> 00:50:34,400 I was preparing to fire him. 918 00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:37,333 He had colluded with one of his own detectives 919 00:50:37,333 --> 00:50:41,033 To replant evidence that had been stolen 920 00:50:41,033 --> 00:50:45,067 By a homicide detective at a homicide scene. 921 00:50:45,067 --> 00:50:47,067 And it was for that reason that I was preparing 922 00:50:47,067 --> 00:50:48,700 To fire him. 923 00:50:56,233 --> 00:50:57,667 I'm just giving you the information I have, 924 00:50:57,667 --> 00:51:00,100 I don't care what you do with it. 925 00:51:00,467 --> 00:51:03,633 I understand that, but I think your investigation 926 00:51:03,633 --> 00:51:06,900 Is into things that our investigation doesn't apply to. 927 00:51:21,067 --> 00:51:23,067 You don't allow a patrol officer 928 00:51:23,067 --> 00:51:26,067 With no homicide investigative experience 929 00:51:26,067 --> 00:51:28,733 To determine whether a scene is a suicide or not. 930 00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,400 My opinion is, in 1994, 931 00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,300 They just didn't look at anything. 932 00:51:39,300 --> 00:51:42,467 If it appeared to be a suicide, it was a suicide. 933 00:51:42,467 --> 00:51:44,267 Case closed. 934 00:51:45,467 --> 00:51:50,467 (Somber music) 935 00:52:19,100 --> 00:52:22,167 The news media do poison the atmosphere, 936 00:52:22,167 --> 00:52:24,333 And I have been involved in cases in which 937 00:52:24,333 --> 00:52:28,833 It was impossible, almost, to overcome the beliefs 938 00:52:28,833 --> 00:52:31,467 That had been created within the community 939 00:52:31,467 --> 00:52:34,267 Because of the way in which that particular death 940 00:52:34,267 --> 00:52:35,467 Had been reported. 941 00:52:35,467 --> 00:52:36,800 Judging by the evidence at the scene, 942 00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:38,900 Love says, Cobain apparently drew a chair up 943 00:52:38,900 --> 00:52:41,733 To a window looking out on Puget Sound, sat down, 944 00:52:41,733 --> 00:52:43,767 Took some more drugs, picked up his shotgun and, 945 00:52:43,767 --> 00:52:46,433 Using his thumb, it seems, shot himself in the head. 946 00:52:46,433 --> 00:52:48,267 The physical damage was so severe that his body could 947 00:52:48,267 --> 00:52:50,600 Only be identified by fingerprints. 948 00:52:50,600 --> 00:52:51,933 I was a bit surprised. 949 00:52:51,933 --> 00:52:53,567 Normally a shotgun wound to the head, 950 00:52:53,567 --> 00:52:55,467 The ones I've seen, are pretty devastating, 951 00:52:55,467 --> 00:52:57,933 Often making facial features unrecognizable. 952 00:52:57,933 --> 00:53:00,867 His head was not grossly deformed or badly damaged. 953 00:53:00,867 --> 00:53:03,100 I think I certainly would've recognized him. 954 00:53:03,100 --> 00:53:05,067 I don't see any reason why anyone wouldn't have, 955 00:53:05,067 --> 00:53:06,467 Who knew what he looked like. 956 00:53:06,467 --> 00:53:08,433 Seattle's own police reports indicate 957 00:53:08,433 --> 00:53:12,133 That Officer Lavendowski found Kurt Cobain's wallet 958 00:53:12,133 --> 00:53:14,067 Lyin' on the floor. 959 00:53:14,067 --> 00:53:17,433 He opened it up and removed his driver's license, 960 00:53:17,433 --> 00:53:20,067 And he put it on top of Cobain's wallet 961 00:53:20,067 --> 00:53:22,433 To take a photograph for evidence. 962 00:53:22,433 --> 00:53:25,067 Most of the media reported that Kurt left 963 00:53:25,067 --> 00:53:27,833 His driver's license exposed, and a lot of 'em went 964 00:53:27,833 --> 00:53:29,467 Into a lotta detail: 965 00:53:29,467 --> 00:53:32,433 That he did that so that everyone would recognize him. 966 00:53:32,433 --> 00:53:34,600 But it was completely false. 967 00:54:09,167 --> 00:54:11,267 Love, who, contrary to rumor, says she and Cobain 968 00:54:11,267 --> 00:54:14,100 Hadn't broken up, says Cobain had first written 969 00:54:14,100 --> 00:54:16,633 A suicide note to her which said, in part, 970 00:54:16,633 --> 00:54:18,533 "It's not fun for me anymore." 971 00:54:18,533 --> 00:54:20,167 "I can't live this life." 972 00:54:20,167 --> 00:54:23,333 News media play a great role in these matters. 973 00:54:23,333 --> 00:54:25,500 John Kennedy, incidentally, pointed out 974 00:54:25,500 --> 00:54:28,700 The need for integrity within the news media. 975 00:54:28,700 --> 00:54:30,200 This has been something that was commented 976 00:54:30,200 --> 00:54:33,633 Upon going back to our founding fathers, 977 00:54:33,633 --> 00:54:36,267 Because sometimes pressures from news media 978 00:54:36,267 --> 00:54:39,267 Can be very, very significant. 979 00:54:39,267 --> 00:54:41,433 I don't have the right to make an opinion 980 00:54:41,433 --> 00:54:44,300 On anything that I read or see on television 981 00:54:44,300 --> 00:54:48,067 Until I go to the fuckin' source myself, personally. 982 00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:54,900 The toxicology report from Kurt Cobain's autopsy 983 00:54:54,900 --> 00:54:59,867 Indicated a heroin blood level of 1.52 milligrams per liter. 984 00:54:59,867 --> 00:55:02,967 Five milligrams will produce a level 985 00:55:02,967 --> 00:55:06,600 Of 0.035 milligrams. 986 00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,067 Most users, even heavy users, 987 00:55:09,067 --> 00:55:12,967 Only use up to 40 to 60 milligrams in one hit. 988 00:55:12,967 --> 00:55:17,333 So you can see, to reach 1.52 milligrams per liter, 989 00:55:17,333 --> 00:55:19,767 You're talking about an amount that would have 990 00:55:19,767 --> 00:55:24,767 Certainly have exceeded 200 milligrams that were injected 991 00:55:24,867 --> 00:55:26,533 Into Kurt Cobain. 992 00:55:26,533 --> 00:55:29,533 Three times the amount that would be considered lethal. 993 00:55:29,533 --> 00:55:32,467 I think very legitimate questions have been raised 994 00:55:32,467 --> 00:55:34,067 About the level of heroin. 995 00:55:34,067 --> 00:55:37,733 We have not, in 18 years, found a single case 996 00:55:37,733 --> 00:55:41,633 Where somebody could have the level of heroin 997 00:55:41,633 --> 00:55:45,967 In their body that Kurt did and still remain conscious. 998 00:55:45,967 --> 00:55:47,333 [Voiceover] 70 times the lethal dose 999 00:55:47,333 --> 00:55:49,833 For the average person, triple the lethal dose 1000 00:55:49,833 --> 00:55:51,667 Even for the most severe heroin addict. 1001 00:55:51,667 --> 00:55:53,100 It would have incapacitated him, 1002 00:55:53,100 --> 00:55:54,700 He would have been unconscious. 1003 00:55:54,700 --> 00:55:57,267 And then roll down their sleeves, put away their heroin kit, 1004 00:55:57,267 --> 00:55:59,133 Pick up the shotgun, position it backwards 1005 00:55:59,133 --> 00:56:00,967 And pull the trigger. 1006 00:56:01,633 --> 00:56:04,233 That deals with coordinative functions. 1007 00:56:04,233 --> 00:56:07,600 How about the emotional aspects of this? 1008 00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:11,433 Why would he then shoot himself before the drug 1009 00:56:11,433 --> 00:56:14,433 Has had a chance to take effect? 1010 00:56:14,500 --> 00:56:18,833 No study that I know of has correlated use 1011 00:56:18,833 --> 00:56:21,967 Of heroin with suicide. 1012 00:56:21,967 --> 00:56:25,833 I cannot think of a case in which I have had someone 1013 00:56:25,833 --> 00:56:29,700 Inject himself with a large amount of heroin 1014 00:56:29,700 --> 00:56:32,200 And then proceed to kill himself. 1015 00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:35,200 It just doesn't make sense, and it doesn't fit in 1016 00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:38,600 With these kinds of situations involving heroin. 1017 00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:41,533 These are questions that I think deserve answers, 1018 00:56:41,533 --> 00:56:43,400 And in fact, require answers. 1019 00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:46,767 Many of the questions could be answered 1020 00:56:46,767 --> 00:56:51,067 If the medical examiner's office would make public 1021 00:56:51,067 --> 00:56:53,067 The autopsy report. 1022 00:56:53,067 --> 00:56:56,133 I haven't been able to see the toxicology report 1023 00:56:56,133 --> 00:57:00,100 Or the autopsy report because I haven't had access 1024 00:57:00,100 --> 00:57:03,867 To review the actual documentation from the authorities. 1025 00:57:03,867 --> 00:57:06,900 The autopsy report is public record. 1026 00:57:06,900 --> 00:57:10,867 Apparently in this jurisdiction, it is not. 1027 00:57:10,867 --> 00:57:13,867 In the case of Kurt Cobain, they should've made them part 1028 00:57:13,867 --> 00:57:16,100 Of the release with the Freedom of Information. 1029 00:57:16,100 --> 00:57:17,367 Why they didn't do that, I dunno. 1030 00:57:17,367 --> 00:57:19,467 In hindsight, maybe they should've. 1031 00:57:19,467 --> 00:57:21,833 We wouldn't be having this discussion today. 1032 00:57:23,500 --> 00:57:27,467 There was a documentary made about 1997, I believe, 1033 00:57:27,467 --> 00:57:29,067 Called "Kurt and Courtney." 1034 00:57:29,067 --> 00:57:31,933 I cooperated with the producer and director of that, 1035 00:57:31,933 --> 00:57:33,533 Nick Broomfield. 1036 00:57:34,233 --> 00:57:37,067 [Voiceover] Tom Grant's assertion that 1.52 milligrams 1037 00:57:37,067 --> 00:57:40,067 Of heroin per liter of blood would have incapacitated 1038 00:57:40,067 --> 00:57:43,567 Kurt were discounted by Doctor Colin Brewer, 1039 00:57:43,567 --> 00:57:46,633 Formerly director at Westminster Hospital. 1040 00:57:46,633 --> 00:57:49,567 He gave us this color slide of a patient balancing easily 1041 00:57:49,567 --> 00:57:52,067 On one leg, who had taken the equivalent 1042 00:57:52,067 --> 00:57:55,067 Of over twice the amount taken by Kurt. 1043 00:57:55,067 --> 00:57:58,167 The problem is that this man had taken methadone, 1044 00:57:58,167 --> 00:58:02,067 Not heroin, and he had swallowed the methadone. 1045 00:58:02,067 --> 00:58:04,733 Methadone is a pain medication. 1046 00:58:04,733 --> 00:58:07,267 It's also used to treat heroin addiction, 1047 00:58:07,267 --> 00:58:10,733 And because it's taken orally, it 's absorbed much slower. 1048 00:58:10,733 --> 00:58:13,933 It takes time to get into the blood, so it can take 1049 00:58:13,933 --> 00:58:16,400 Up to an hour or perhaps two before it reaches 1050 00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:19,233 Its highest concentrations. 1051 00:58:19,233 --> 00:58:23,133 Heroin, on the other hand, injected directly into the vein, 1052 00:58:23,133 --> 00:58:26,267 Is immediately available to circulation, 1053 00:58:26,267 --> 00:58:28,233 Immediately available to the brain. 1054 00:58:28,233 --> 00:58:33,200 Comparing oral methadone to intravenous heroin. 1055 00:58:33,767 --> 00:58:37,067 What's the trade expression, apples and oranges? 1056 00:58:37,067 --> 00:58:38,833 It's much worse than apples and oranges. 1057 00:58:38,833 --> 00:58:41,700 It might be peaches and asparagus that you're comparing. 1058 00:58:41,700 --> 00:58:44,600 I'm surely amazed that a competent forensic scientist 1059 00:58:44,600 --> 00:58:47,833 Would have made that kind of comparison. 1060 00:58:47,833 --> 00:58:52,833 (Eerie music) 1061 00:58:53,533 --> 00:58:55,100 [Voiceover] Seattle police reports indicate 1062 00:58:55,100 --> 00:58:59,067 That Kurt Cobain was found with a shotgun upside down, 1063 00:58:59,067 --> 00:59:01,067 With his left hand grasping the barrel 1064 00:59:01,067 --> 00:59:04,233 In a vise-like grip, known as a cadaveric spasm. 1065 00:59:05,233 --> 00:59:08,067 Cadaveric spasm is a form of muscular stiffening 1066 00:59:08,067 --> 00:59:10,467 That only occurs in death. 1067 00:59:10,467 --> 00:59:14,133 This occurrence is indispensable to forensic investigation, 1068 00:59:14,133 --> 00:59:17,633 As it clearly shows the precise orientation of the deceased 1069 00:59:17,633 --> 00:59:20,133 At the exact moment of death; 1070 00:59:20,133 --> 00:59:22,167 In this case, Cobain's left hand 1071 00:59:22,167 --> 00:59:25,667 Gripping the barrel upside down, as he was found. 1072 00:59:25,667 --> 00:59:27,133 (Camera shutter) 1073 00:59:27,133 --> 00:59:29,867 This all seemed straightforward, until you take into account 1074 00:59:29,867 --> 00:59:33,200 The shotgun shell was found to Cobain's left side, 1075 00:59:33,200 --> 00:59:36,067 Opposite of where we'd expect to find the shell: 1076 00:59:36,067 --> 00:59:39,067 On Cobain's right side. 1077 00:59:39,067 --> 00:59:42,433 The exit chamber is clearly on Cobain's right side 1078 00:59:42,433 --> 00:59:45,400 If it was fired upside down, as it was found, 1079 00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:49,167 And as the cadaveric spasm confirms 1080 00:59:49,167 --> 00:59:51,800 Seattle P.D. explained the illogical trajectory 1081 00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:54,467 Of the shotgun shell by concluding that the shotgun 1082 00:59:54,467 --> 00:59:57,067 Was fired right side up by Cobain, 1083 00:59:57,067 --> 01:00:00,167 The shotgun flipped upside down, expelling the shell 1084 01:00:00,167 --> 01:00:02,867 To his left, to finally rest in the position 1085 01:00:02,867 --> 01:00:04,500 That it was found. 1086 01:00:04,500 --> 01:00:07,467 This proposed scenario is impossible, not only 1087 01:00:07,467 --> 01:00:10,767 Because shotguns do not flip upside down when fired; 1088 01:00:10,767 --> 01:00:13,133 It completely ignores the cadaveric spasm 1089 01:00:13,133 --> 01:00:16,800 That locks the grip, dictating the precise orientation 1090 01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:18,967 Of the shotgun when fired. 1091 01:00:18,967 --> 01:00:22,400 In order for the scenario the Seattle police stated occurred 1092 01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:25,000 Cobain's wrist would have to bend at an angle 1093 01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:28,033 That is anatomically impossible. 1094 01:00:28,033 --> 01:00:31,433 The cadaveric spasm shows the precise orientation 1095 01:00:31,433 --> 01:00:34,933 Of Cobain's hand at the exact moment of death. 1096 01:00:34,933 --> 01:00:37,800 The only way that the shell could end up in the opposite 1097 01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:41,433 Side of the room is if, when the shell was expelled, 1098 01:00:41,433 --> 01:00:44,000 Hit an obstruction on Cobain's right side 1099 01:00:44,000 --> 01:00:47,800 And ricocheted to Cobain's left side, to land on the jacket. 1100 01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:52,000 The crime scene clearly shows there was no such obstruction, 1101 01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:55,433 Which then puts into question if Cobain truly was alone 1102 01:00:55,433 --> 01:00:58,767 In the Greenhouse when the trigger was pulled. 1103 01:00:59,567 --> 01:01:02,067 [Rosemary] Kurt was not suicidal. 1104 01:01:02,567 --> 01:01:03,900 Have you been watchin' TV? 1105 01:01:03,900 --> 01:01:05,067 Readin' the paper? 1106 01:01:05,067 --> 01:01:06,500 They're all saying that he's been suicidal 1107 01:01:06,500 --> 01:01:08,467 For a long time, and Courtney said that this overdose, 1108 01:01:08,467 --> 01:01:09,800 The one that was in Rome, she said 1109 01:01:09,800 --> 01:01:11,233 That was a suicide attempt. 1110 01:01:11,233 --> 01:01:12,533 That's not true. 1111 01:01:12,533 --> 01:01:14,533 It was Rosemary Carroll's involvement 1112 01:01:14,533 --> 01:01:17,300 That really pushed me forward, because if somebody 1113 01:01:17,300 --> 01:01:20,833 In Rosemary Carroll's position was telling me 1114 01:01:20,833 --> 01:01:23,200 The things she was telling me, 1115 01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:27,167 Then I wasn't off base, I wasn't crazy, 1116 01:01:27,167 --> 01:01:28,667 I wasn't a lunatic. 1117 01:01:28,667 --> 01:01:30,200 She called me a couple of weeks ago, 1118 01:01:30,200 --> 01:01:32,600 Said Kurt was leaving her and asked me to find the meanest, 1119 01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:35,133 Most vicious divorce lawyer I could find. 1120 01:01:35,133 --> 01:01:36,333 She even asked me if there was any way 1121 01:01:36,333 --> 01:01:37,633 To avoid their prenup. 1122 01:01:37,633 --> 01:01:39,100 And she said about that same time, 1123 01:01:39,100 --> 01:01:41,867 Kurt had called her also and asked her if she could 1124 01:01:41,867 --> 01:01:44,433 Have Courtney's name taken outta the will. 1125 01:01:44,433 --> 01:01:49,433 (Eerie music) 1126 01:02:00,300 --> 01:02:02,367 Does it seem strange that Courtney didn't go 1127 01:02:02,367 --> 01:02:04,633 Up to Seattle, not even once, to look for him? 1128 01:02:04,633 --> 01:02:06,433 Absolutely. 1129 01:02:07,167 --> 01:02:09,167 When I offered to go up, she said she couldn't go 1130 01:02:09,167 --> 01:02:12,200 With me because she had some business down here in L.A. 1131 01:02:12,200 --> 01:02:14,433 She didn't have any business in L.A. 1132 01:02:14,933 --> 01:02:17,167 What I don't understand is how you didn't see him 1133 01:02:17,167 --> 01:02:19,133 In the Greenhouse the first night you were there. 1134 01:02:19,133 --> 01:02:20,600 Wait a minute, I didn't even know the Greenhouse 1135 01:02:20,600 --> 01:02:22,833 Existed until the day I heard it on the radio. 1136 01:02:22,833 --> 01:02:24,833 But Courtney told Dylan to check it. 1137 01:02:24,833 --> 01:02:26,667 When he called Courtney at my house Wednesday night, 1138 01:02:26,667 --> 01:02:30,067 I heard her tell him to check the Greenhouse. 1139 01:02:39,067 --> 01:02:42,500 A lotta people mock him for being at the house, 1140 01:02:42,500 --> 01:02:44,333 On the case, looking for Kurt. 1141 01:02:44,333 --> 01:02:47,500 Kurt was lying dead 20 feet away and he never found him. 1142 01:02:47,500 --> 01:02:51,400 What does that say about his abilities as a P.I? 1143 01:02:52,233 --> 01:02:54,433 I went back on a rainy night. 1144 01:02:54,433 --> 01:02:57,467 He claims it was dark and just didn't know it was there. 1145 01:02:57,467 --> 01:02:59,767 Nobody told him, Dylan certainly didn't tell him. 1146 01:02:59,767 --> 01:03:02,067 Dylan must have known that it was there. 1147 01:03:02,067 --> 01:03:03,800 [Tom] Is there anywhere else? 1148 01:03:03,800 --> 01:03:05,167 No. 1149 01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:08,133 [Max] So I went and tested that, and sure enough, 1150 01:03:08,133 --> 01:03:10,067 You really couldn't see it if you weren't looking 1151 01:03:10,067 --> 01:03:11,267 For it specifically. 1152 01:03:11,267 --> 01:03:16,267 (Eerie music) 1153 01:03:28,300 --> 01:03:30,367 I asked Courtney to see the note when I was in Seattle, 1154 01:03:30,367 --> 01:03:31,867 And she refused. 1155 01:03:31,867 --> 01:03:33,833 Courtney apparently had let Danny Goldberg, 1156 01:03:33,833 --> 01:03:36,400 Her husband, see the note, but she wouldn't let 1157 01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:39,200 Rosemary see it, so that mystified her too 1158 01:03:39,200 --> 01:03:40,867 And made her more suspicious. 1159 01:03:40,867 --> 01:03:43,833 And it made me more suspicious, too. 1160 01:03:43,833 --> 01:03:47,067 To hear Courtney's own lawyer, 1161 01:03:47,067 --> 01:03:49,733 Kurt and Courtney's entertainment lawyer, Rosemary Carroll, 1162 01:03:50,300 --> 01:03:53,067 The godmother of Frances Bean, 1163 01:03:53,700 --> 01:03:57,367 Somebody that knew them better than almost anybody, 1164 01:03:58,200 --> 01:04:01,200 Telling Tom that 1165 01:04:02,067 --> 01:04:04,967 They were in the middle of a divorce, 1166 01:04:04,967 --> 01:04:07,533 That Kurt was drawing up a new will, 1167 01:04:08,633 --> 01:04:11,067 And most importantly, I think the tape 1168 01:04:11,067 --> 01:04:14,600 That really had me reeling, 1169 01:04:15,500 --> 01:04:20,433 Was hearing Rosemary Carroll looking at the suicide note 1170 01:04:20,433 --> 01:04:22,800 And immediately concluding that it's a forgery. 1171 01:05:03,100 --> 01:05:05,500 I believe Courtney never thought the public was gonna 1172 01:05:05,500 --> 01:05:07,400 Ever see that note. 1173 01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:09,933 If I hadn't have tricked her out of a copy of the note, 1174 01:05:09,933 --> 01:05:11,767 They wouldn't have seen it. 1175 01:05:12,567 --> 01:05:14,367 I heard you read the note on TV the other day 1176 01:05:14,367 --> 01:05:16,967 And I'm just a little confused about something. 1177 01:05:17,767 --> 01:05:21,233 It sounded like the note said, "I'm lying on the bed." 1178 01:05:21,233 --> 01:05:23,967 If Kurt was lying in the bed when he wrote the note, 1179 01:05:23,967 --> 01:05:26,700 Why was the bed so neat when I came here the other night? 1180 01:05:26,700 --> 01:05:29,067 It looked like nobody had been on the bed. 1181 01:05:29,067 --> 01:05:32,067 I was lying on the bed, recording the message 1182 01:05:32,067 --> 01:05:33,833 For Kurt's fans. 1183 01:05:33,833 --> 01:05:35,600 Are you sure that's what you said? 1184 01:05:35,600 --> 01:05:39,100 Because I was under the impression that Kurt was lying 1185 01:05:39,100 --> 01:05:40,233 On the bed. 1186 01:05:40,233 --> 01:05:42,733 Look, I'll show you, okay? 1187 01:05:44,233 --> 01:05:48,800 It's just a copy, but the cops have the original. 1188 01:05:50,900 --> 01:05:55,200 I can't read this without my glasses. 1189 01:05:55,200 --> 01:05:56,967 I'm gonna take it down, make a copy in the fax machine. 1190 01:05:56,967 --> 01:05:58,600 I'll read it later. 1191 01:06:00,200 --> 01:06:02,433 Yeah, sure. 1192 01:06:14,867 --> 01:06:17,700 [Rosemary] That I never thought to look at at all, 1193 01:06:17,700 --> 01:06:20,667 Quite honestly, until last night. 1194 01:06:20,667 --> 01:06:22,633 She left it after she came over to my house, 1195 01:06:22,633 --> 01:06:24,100 The night of the 6th. 1196 01:06:24,100 --> 01:06:26,800 Rosemary Carroll was working with me behind the scenes, 1197 01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:29,733 Privately, giving me information. 1198 01:06:29,733 --> 01:06:32,400 She did it out of a good conscience. 1199 01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:33,667 [Rosemary] What do you think that is? 1200 01:06:57,467 --> 01:07:02,467 (Eerie music) 1201 01:08:11,067 --> 01:08:14,667 [Courtney] (Indistinct) conference on your phone, 1202 01:08:14,667 --> 01:08:16,700 And that way you could... 1203 01:08:16,700 --> 01:08:18,100 [Tom] You've promised me things before, 1204 01:08:18,100 --> 01:08:20,067 And it didn't come through. 1205 01:08:21,533 --> 01:08:23,800 Almost immediately after Kurt Cobain's death 1206 01:08:23,800 --> 01:08:26,633 Was announced in the media, this phenomenon 1207 01:08:26,633 --> 01:08:29,467 Of copycat suicides began. 1208 01:08:29,467 --> 01:08:31,733 Kids started killing themselves: 1209 01:08:31,733 --> 01:08:34,500 Kurt Cobain fans, Nirvana fans. 1210 01:08:34,500 --> 01:08:37,067 This was happening all around the world. 1211 01:08:37,067 --> 01:08:41,467 Now I'm a dad myself, and it's just, 1212 01:08:42,933 --> 01:08:44,100 Absolutely breaks my heart. 1213 01:08:44,100 --> 01:08:45,900 I talk to a lotta the families. 1214 01:08:46,633 --> 01:08:50,467 When you read their suicide notes and read their journals, 1215 01:08:50,467 --> 01:08:54,233 It really drove home the importance 1216 01:08:55,333 --> 01:08:57,333 Of Kurt on this generation. 1217 01:08:58,067 --> 01:09:01,800 The thought of losing a child is just horrific. 1218 01:09:01,800 --> 01:09:05,100 I was relieved that I was gonna go forward with this, 1219 01:09:05,100 --> 01:09:07,167 Because I thought, "Maybe it'll help stop" 1220 01:09:07,167 --> 01:09:09,167 "Some of these copycat suicides." 1221 01:09:09,167 --> 01:09:14,167 (Sad music) 1222 01:09:33,767 --> 01:09:35,300 [Tom] That would help too, to be analyzed. 1223 01:09:35,300 --> 01:09:38,867 We could determine whether Kurt wrote that whole thing. 1224 01:09:39,700 --> 01:09:42,300 The fact that the handwriting looks, 1225 01:09:42,300 --> 01:09:45,500 To my untrained eye, different at the bottom 1226 01:09:45,500 --> 01:09:48,133 Of that note than it does during the body 1227 01:09:48,133 --> 01:09:50,533 It certainly does suggest that putting that note 1228 01:09:50,533 --> 01:09:53,533 In the hands of a questioned documents examiner, 1229 01:09:53,533 --> 01:09:57,700 Somebody who really understands a lot more than we do 1230 01:09:57,700 --> 01:10:00,167 As cops, that would be a good idea. 1231 01:10:00,167 --> 01:10:03,100 A forensic document examiner examines documents 1232 01:10:03,100 --> 01:10:05,700 For the purposes of authenticity. 1233 01:10:05,700 --> 01:10:08,633 I examined a handwriting sample that was found 1234 01:10:08,633 --> 01:10:12,500 In Courtney Love's backpack, and it was a practice sheet 1235 01:10:12,500 --> 01:10:15,833 Of different letters, the alphabet. 1236 01:10:15,833 --> 01:10:20,500 I examined that in comparison to the suicide note. 1237 01:10:20,500 --> 01:10:23,133 What I did find interesting about the practice sheet is 1238 01:10:23,133 --> 01:10:26,300 That it did have letter combinations and specific letters 1239 01:10:26,300 --> 01:10:31,300 That are found in the bottom portion of the suicide note. 1240 01:10:31,367 --> 01:10:34,933 It is possible that somebody else with some skill 1241 01:10:34,933 --> 01:10:38,400 Could indeed imitate his writing, 1242 01:10:38,400 --> 01:10:40,900 Especially those last few lines. 1243 01:10:43,500 --> 01:10:46,533 One of the, perhaps surprising, characteristics 1244 01:10:46,533 --> 01:10:51,067 Of this note is that the largest section of the note, 1245 01:10:51,067 --> 01:10:54,333 Or the initial part, talks so much about his relationship 1246 01:10:54,333 --> 01:10:58,433 To music, and it's only the very small part of the note, 1247 01:10:58,433 --> 01:11:02,467 The last four lines, that talks about his relationship 1248 01:11:02,467 --> 01:11:04,100 To his family. 1249 01:11:04,900 --> 01:11:07,733 But there's another linguistically interesting thing 1250 01:11:07,733 --> 01:11:12,733 About the second or final four lines of the note, 1251 01:11:13,433 --> 01:11:18,433 And that is that that is what most of us would consider 1252 01:11:19,067 --> 01:11:21,733 A stereotypical suicide note. 1253 01:11:22,133 --> 01:11:25,667 "I love you, someone will be better off without me," 1254 01:11:25,667 --> 01:11:27,467 "Keep moving forward." 1255 01:11:28,400 --> 01:11:32,167 Those are the kinds of things we expect to find 1256 01:11:32,167 --> 01:11:36,500 In suicide notes, or even in overkill, 1257 01:11:36,500 --> 01:11:40,967 To make it very stereotypical so that people couldn't miss 1258 01:11:40,967 --> 01:11:42,067 What it was. 1259 01:11:42,067 --> 01:11:47,067 (Eerie music) 1260 01:11:48,567 --> 01:11:51,133 There are a lotta questions I have for Dylan and Cali, 1261 01:11:51,133 --> 01:11:53,533 Especially Cali, who spent more time here at the house 1262 01:11:53,533 --> 01:11:55,967 Than anybody last week. 1263 01:11:57,433 --> 01:12:00,533 Cali is, he just left for rehab. 1264 01:12:00,600 --> 01:12:03,400 He's in El Paso, or 1265 01:12:04,567 --> 01:12:06,767 Georgia, I think. 1266 01:12:08,500 --> 01:12:11,967 No no no, he's in L.A. with friends. 1267 01:12:15,900 --> 01:12:17,700 I'll get Dylan over here. 1268 01:12:18,767 --> 01:12:21,833 After probably a half an hour or so, I walked out 1269 01:12:21,833 --> 01:12:24,967 And I asked, "Is Dylan here yet?" 1270 01:12:24,967 --> 01:12:27,667 "I haven't seen him," and I just assumed that somebody 1271 01:12:27,667 --> 01:12:29,767 Would let me know when he showed up. 1272 01:12:29,767 --> 01:12:32,333 They said, "Yeah, he's upstairs with Courtney," 1273 01:12:32,333 --> 01:12:33,700 Which I thought was strange. 1274 01:12:33,700 --> 01:12:35,233 He was supposed to be coming in the house to talk 1275 01:12:35,233 --> 01:12:39,433 To me, not go upstairs and do a pre-interview with Courtney. 1276 01:12:40,067 --> 01:12:41,500 So there's just been a couple things that have been 1277 01:12:41,500 --> 01:12:44,100 Eating at me in the last few weeks, and I wanted to sit here 1278 01:12:44,100 --> 01:12:46,267 And I wanted to talk to you about them. 1279 01:12:49,100 --> 01:12:50,567 Did you just shoot up? 1280 01:12:51,233 --> 01:12:52,467 [Dylan] Hm? 1281 01:12:53,067 --> 01:12:54,633 [Tom] Did you just shoot up? 1282 01:12:56,500 --> 01:12:57,300 Yeah. 1283 01:12:57,300 --> 01:12:58,367 [Tom] What? 1284 01:12:58,367 --> 01:12:59,867 Yes. 1285 01:12:59,867 --> 01:13:01,367 Why did you do that? 1286 01:13:01,367 --> 01:13:02,267 I told you I was coming up here, I told you we had 1287 01:13:02,267 --> 01:13:04,100 To have this conversation. 1288 01:13:04,900 --> 01:13:05,433 Dylan. 1289 01:13:05,433 --> 01:13:06,900 Hm? 1290 01:13:06,900 --> 01:13:09,100 [Tom] I told you we had to have this conversation. 1291 01:13:09,833 --> 01:13:10,867 I'm ready. 1292 01:13:10,867 --> 01:13:12,067 [Tom] You're ready? 1293 01:13:12,067 --> 01:13:13,267 - Mm hmm. - [Tom] You're not ready. 1294 01:13:13,267 --> 01:13:14,633 [Tom] I felt, "Why would Courtney do this?" 1295 01:13:14,633 --> 01:13:17,300 She knew I had some serious questions to ask him, 1296 01:13:17,300 --> 01:13:20,400 And she's sending him down to me in a drugged state 1297 01:13:20,400 --> 01:13:23,133 Of mind, where he could hardly talk? 1298 01:13:23,133 --> 01:13:25,300 You check the front door or the back? 1299 01:13:25,300 --> 01:13:27,100 Did you check the front door or the back door? 1300 01:13:27,100 --> 01:13:27,867 Yeah. 1301 01:13:27,867 --> 01:13:28,933 [Tom] Which door? 1302 01:13:28,933 --> 01:13:30,200 Both. 1303 01:13:30,200 --> 01:13:31,200 [Tom] Both doors. Did you check the side door? 1304 01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:32,367 No. 1305 01:13:32,367 --> 01:13:33,367 [Tom] You didn't go to the side door? 1306 01:13:33,367 --> 01:13:34,600 I don't remember. 1307 01:13:34,600 --> 01:13:35,533 [Tom] You don't remember. 1308 01:13:35,533 --> 01:13:37,167 Did you go to the Greenhouse? 1309 01:13:37,167 --> 01:13:38,333 [Dylan] No. 1310 01:13:38,333 --> 01:13:39,700 You didn't go to the Greenhouse? 1311 01:13:39,700 --> 01:13:42,733 Dylan, Dylan, I wanna talk about... 1312 01:13:44,100 --> 01:13:46,333 I wanna talk about the Greenhouse. 1313 01:13:48,933 --> 01:13:50,200 Dylan. 1314 01:13:50,867 --> 01:13:52,267 Dylan was a heroin addict, 1315 01:13:52,267 --> 01:13:54,933 And he needed a source for heroin. 1316 01:13:54,933 --> 01:13:59,267 Once Kurt Cobain was dead, his source became Courtney Love. 1317 01:13:59,267 --> 01:14:01,967 His loyalty became Courtney Love. 1318 01:14:02,967 --> 01:14:04,200 He was very dependent on her. 1319 01:14:04,200 --> 01:14:06,567 We've since learned that she paid his rent 1320 01:14:06,567 --> 01:14:09,067 For many, many years, supplied the money 1321 01:14:09,067 --> 01:14:12,567 For his heroin, and almost everybody around Kurt. 1322 01:14:12,567 --> 01:14:13,867 They were dependent on Courtney, 1323 01:14:13,867 --> 01:14:15,767 They were dependent on Courtney's money. 1324 01:14:19,400 --> 01:14:22,767 It's a waste of time, waste of time. 1325 01:14:31,133 --> 01:14:34,133 I felt it was my duty to notify my client 1326 01:14:34,133 --> 01:14:36,500 That I was starting to dig into some directions 1327 01:14:36,500 --> 01:14:39,533 That she may not want me to be looking into, 1328 01:14:39,533 --> 01:14:42,233 But I was determined to do it and I thought 1329 01:14:42,233 --> 01:14:45,900 That she deserved to know that I was going to do this. 1330 01:14:47,900 --> 01:14:50,533 She got the message, I'm sure, from that. 1331 01:14:50,533 --> 01:14:52,967 I was insinuating that I suspected her 1332 01:14:52,967 --> 01:14:54,833 Of being involved in this. 1333 01:14:55,667 --> 01:14:57,667 A few days after that letter was sent, 1334 01:14:57,667 --> 01:14:59,867 I got a phone call from Courtney. 1335 01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:03,167 She wasn't livid, she wasn't even angry. 1336 01:15:03,167 --> 01:15:05,400 She didn't mention the letter, in fact. 1337 01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:08,900 I basically said I'm going to continue with my investigation 1338 01:15:08,900 --> 01:15:11,633 With or without your cooperation. 1339 01:15:52,400 --> 01:15:53,633 Here's all you have to do to bring this 1340 01:15:53,633 --> 01:15:55,767 To a quick end and solve all of your problems. 1341 01:16:34,467 --> 01:16:39,467 (Ominous music) 1342 01:17:13,700 --> 01:17:18,633 (Eerie music) 1343 01:17:22,600 --> 01:17:27,600 (Sad guitar music) 1344 01:18:03,667 --> 01:18:05,833 Yes, hi, I'm looking for Kurt. 1345 01:18:07,400 --> 01:18:08,533 Hello? 1346 01:18:08,533 --> 01:18:13,533 (Sad guitar music) 1347 01:18:23,233 --> 01:18:24,700 Hello? 1348 01:18:26,233 --> 01:18:27,800 Yes, hi. Someone's gonna get really fucked up over there 1349 01:18:27,800 --> 01:18:29,467 If I don't talk to Kurt. 1350 01:18:31,833 --> 01:18:34,300 Hi, this is Julie Bernstein. 1351 01:18:34,300 --> 01:18:36,867 I really need to speak to my client Kurt. 1352 01:18:36,867 --> 01:18:38,233 Get him on the fucking phone! 1353 01:18:38,233 --> 01:18:43,200 (Sad guitar music) 1354 01:18:52,600 --> 01:18:54,167 Yes, yeah, thank you. 1355 01:18:54,167 --> 01:18:55,767 No, no problem. 1356 01:18:56,533 --> 01:18:57,933 Yeah, Delta's fine. 1357 01:18:57,933 --> 01:19:02,933 (Sad guitar music) 1358 01:20:49,967 --> 01:20:54,967 (Eerie music) 1359 01:21:11,067 --> 01:21:12,933 [Voiceover] with the 20th anniversary approaching, 1360 01:21:12,933 --> 01:21:15,833 Detective Mike Ciesynski re-examined the case files 1361 01:21:15,833 --> 01:21:18,900 Of an assignment early in his fledgling career, 1362 01:21:18,900 --> 01:21:22,333 The investigation into the death of Kurt Cobain. 1363 01:21:22,700 --> 01:21:24,733 You can never really realize what type 1364 01:21:24,733 --> 01:21:26,867 Of conspiracy theorists are gonna come out 1365 01:21:26,867 --> 01:21:28,300 Of the woodwork. 1366 01:21:28,300 --> 01:21:31,933 The amount of heroin that he injected was 10 times 1367 01:21:31,933 --> 01:21:35,600 What, normally, anybody would've taken, 1368 01:21:35,600 --> 01:21:37,400 Even a heavy heroin user. 1369 01:21:37,400 --> 01:21:41,967 I believe he gave himself a fatal dose of black tar heroin. 1370 01:21:42,833 --> 01:21:47,833 (Eerie music) 1371 01:21:51,500 --> 01:21:53,933 [Voiceover] Detective Mike Ciesynski found four rolls 1372 01:21:53,933 --> 01:21:56,733 Of undeveloped crime scene photos. 1373 01:21:56,733 --> 01:21:59,067 Two of those photos were released, 1374 01:21:59,067 --> 01:22:01,367 Taken the day his body was found. 1375 01:22:01,367 --> 01:22:04,567 In hindsight, I think I would've developed the film. 1376 01:22:04,567 --> 01:22:05,967 [Voiceover] Did you find anything different 1377 01:22:05,967 --> 01:22:08,367 That made you believe it's anything but suicide? 1378 01:22:08,367 --> 01:22:09,767 No, nothing. 1379 01:22:09,767 --> 01:22:12,133 What are people gonna gain from seeing pictures 1380 01:22:12,133 --> 01:22:13,333 Of Kurt Cobain? 1381 01:22:13,333 --> 01:22:15,233 How is that gonna benefit anybody? 1382 01:22:15,233 --> 01:22:18,200 It wasn't gonna change my decision that this was a suicide, 1383 01:22:18,200 --> 01:22:20,667 And actually I'm the one who makes the decision finally, 1384 01:22:20,667 --> 01:22:22,067 Do we go forward or not. 1385 01:22:22,067 --> 01:22:25,400 There is never one item that I said definitely 1386 01:22:25,400 --> 01:22:27,767 That this actually was suicide, but um... 1387 01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:47,300 Any re-examination should not even be actively 1388 01:22:47,300 --> 01:22:50,800 Participated in by the Seattle Police Department. 1389 01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:54,533 To expect them to conduct an objective, detached, 1390 01:22:54,533 --> 01:22:57,300 Unbiased investigation, come back 20 years later 1391 01:22:57,300 --> 01:22:59,833 And say, "Hey man, we blew it?" 1392 01:22:59,833 --> 01:23:03,800 It flies in the face of common sense. 1393 01:23:03,800 --> 01:23:07,900 The Kurt Cobain death demands a re-opening 1394 01:23:07,900 --> 01:23:12,467 By an objective set of experts, and until that is done, 1395 01:23:12,467 --> 01:23:15,433 Then one cannot feel comfortable in saying 1396 01:23:15,433 --> 01:23:20,333 That Kurt Cobain's death was a clear-cut suicide. 1397 01:23:23,200 --> 01:23:27,233 (Eerie music) (Rain) 1398 01:23:27,233 --> 01:23:29,333 For me, the most compelling piece of evidence 1399 01:23:29,333 --> 01:23:33,067 That convinces me, almost to a certainty, 1400 01:23:33,067 --> 01:23:36,100 That Kurt was murdered, was the level of heroin in his body. 1401 01:23:37,667 --> 01:23:40,333 There's never been a documented case in the history 1402 01:23:40,333 --> 01:23:43,367 Of law enforcement where somebody could have 1403 01:23:43,367 --> 01:23:47,100 The level of heroin in their body that Kurt did, 1404 01:23:47,100 --> 01:23:51,833 Still remain conscious, and still led to a suicide. 1405 01:23:53,467 --> 01:23:56,367 We talked to an FBI expert, and he said, 1406 01:23:56,367 --> 01:23:58,667 "If you wanna get away with murder," 1407 01:23:59,333 --> 01:24:01,167 "You kill a junkie." 1408 01:24:01,167 --> 01:24:06,167 It's very easy to make a murder look 1409 01:24:06,233 --> 01:24:09,400 Look like an accidental overdose or a suicide. 1410 01:24:10,067 --> 01:24:14,467 It's the perfect crime, and it happens all the time. 1411 01:24:16,067 --> 01:24:20,700 We know that Kurt and Courtney had a prenuptial agreement. 1412 01:24:21,533 --> 01:24:23,467 They were in the process of getting a divorce. 1413 01:24:23,467 --> 01:24:26,067 This was confirmed, they were divorcing. 1414 01:24:26,067 --> 01:24:27,867 He was leaving her. 1415 01:24:28,467 --> 01:24:30,467 If the divorce had gone through, 1416 01:24:31,100 --> 01:24:34,267 She would've received a very small settlement 1417 01:24:34,267 --> 01:24:36,633 As a result of the prenuptial agreement. 1418 01:24:37,133 --> 01:24:41,067 When he died, she co-inherited an estate worth 1419 01:24:41,067 --> 01:24:44,233 Possibly more than a billion dollars in future royalties. 1420 01:24:45,067 --> 01:24:47,433 Police immediately look at motive. 1421 01:24:47,433 --> 01:24:48,900 Here's the motive. 1422 01:24:51,433 --> 01:24:54,667 No matter what anybody believes, this happened 1423 01:24:54,667 --> 01:24:58,533 Far too quickly for the kinds of things to be accomplished 1424 01:24:58,533 --> 01:25:03,267 That need to be done in this kind of death investigation. 1425 01:25:03,267 --> 01:25:07,633 We should, in fact, have taken steps to study patterns 1426 01:25:07,633 --> 01:25:12,633 Involved in the behavior of key individuals who had a motive 1427 01:25:13,500 --> 01:25:15,800 To see Kurt Cobain dead. 1428 01:25:16,767 --> 01:25:20,367 This would be in fact, a classical example for how 1429 01:25:20,367 --> 01:25:23,067 An investigation should not be done. 1430 01:25:23,067 --> 01:25:26,900 If, in fact, Kurt Cobain was murdered, as opposed 1431 01:25:26,900 --> 01:25:30,900 To having committed suicide, and it was possible 1432 01:25:30,900 --> 01:25:34,367 To learn that, shame on us for not doing that. 1433 01:25:34,367 --> 01:25:37,167 That was, in fact, our responsibility. 1434 01:25:37,167 --> 01:25:40,200 Should the case be re-opened? 1435 01:25:40,200 --> 01:25:43,067 My answer is unequivocally, unhesitatingly, 1436 01:25:43,067 --> 01:25:45,667 "Yes, the case should be re-opened." 1437 01:25:45,667 --> 01:25:47,433 It's about right and wrong. 1438 01:25:47,433 --> 01:25:51,633 It's about honor, it's about ethics. 1439 01:25:51,633 --> 01:25:53,400 If we didn't get it right the first time, 1440 01:25:53,400 --> 01:25:56,233 We damn well better get it right the second time. 1441 01:25:56,233 --> 01:25:58,267 And I would tell you right now that if I were the 1442 01:25:58,267 --> 01:26:01,667 Chief today, I would re-open this investigation. 1443 01:26:07,100 --> 01:26:12,100 (Birds chirping) (Eerie music) 1444 01:26:32,767 --> 01:26:37,767 (Guitar music) 1445 01:26:58,400 --> 01:27:03,400 (Rock music) 1445 01:27:04,305 --> 01:27:10,706 Support us and become VIP member to remove all ads from OpenSubtitles.org